Octopus replacement idea

[scooters]

OK, we know that the octopus was a PSA cheapskate bodge to save some dosh.

How feasible would it be do you think to replace the rubber octopus with copper brake pipes and unions - obviously in certain places the multi pipe junctions will need to be relocated and mounted on the body but in theory could this work?

Could be quite a long job and a lot of flaring involved

[Defender110]

Do a search , it's been brought up many times before with plenty similar ideas.

[scooters]

So I see. Looks like the sort of pipework you'd have to create yourself rather than off the shelf. I noticed on one of the octopus threads there is a post about a mechanic mentioning that a customer had had nickle pipes made. Copper would suffice and would last 10 years plus...even more if painted. The unions could be interesting though.

[philhod]

You can do this, in fact I already did some years back.
I made a connector block from Cunifer but you could use aluminium and mounted it on the rear face of the front crossmember,. with the required take offs for the pipework
Copper will last forever really but can work harden and crack when being formed.
Cunifer pipe is readily available and is probably the best material to use being a copper/nickle alloy

[MULLEY]

So I see. Looks like the sort of pipework you'd have to create yourself rather than off the shelf. I noticed on one of the octopus threads there is a post about a mechanic mentioning that a customer had had nickle pipes made. Copper would suffice and would last 10 years plus...even more if painted. The unions could be interesting though.

Why would you want to replace some rubber pipes which seem to last 15+years with metal that might only last 10+ years?

Whilst they are still available i'd just get them replaced, when they become nla, then something else would need to be created, but until that time whats the point?

[Defender110]

[scooters]

So I see. Looks like the sort of pipework you'd have to create yourself rather than off the shelf. I noticed on one of the octopus threads there is a post about a mechanic mentioning that a customer had had nickle pipes made. Copper would suffice and would last 10 years plus...even more if painted. The unions could be interesting though.

Why would you want to replace some rubber pipes which seem to last 15+years with metal that might only last 10+ years?

Whilst they are still available i'd just get them replaced, when they become nla, then something else would need to be created, but until that time whats the point?

I like a challenge and also the peace of mind of knowing that the HP isnae gonna go on me when I am visiting a client in Sutherland.

10 years is a very pessimistic estimate for copper pipe. My old '54 moggy had its pipes replaced in 1980 with copper and they were in excellent condition when I sold it in 2010.

Cunifer pipes effectively will outlast the car but are a wee bit more tricky to work with than copper.

[Wooscary]

Isn't the idea of some kind of metal version down to not so much the ideal lifespan of either material but that a rubber version has more possibility of prematurely rupturing whereas a properly made metal one has less of this problem?

[MULLEY]

Metal could fatigue due to engine vibration, & movement if it's homemade. I've heard that cunifer pipes if not done correctly break due to vibration, so even those aren't going to give you 100% reliability. I reckon the rubber octopus whilst some view as a pain because they break/split is not really a major issue as it lasts so long anyway. I've had both of mine replaced due to splitting, it will now outlast the car.

If its just a project/challenge like you say, fair enough & i guess the more that have a go at diy will eventually mean that when the originals are nla there wont be a major panic as there should be a few working examples in existence that we can copy. You'll have to keep us informed of how you get on.

[mat_fenwick]

Did you see this link? There are some interesting ideas, but probably not one I'll pursue until I have to. I don't view it as much of a risk, as a leak is unlikely to be both sudden and catastrophic.

But good luck with it, and would be interested to see more ideas and photos.

[docchevron]

bus / lorry plastic air pipe and suitable press fit connectors, cheap as chips, will last forever. That's what I'll be doing.

[Defender110]

bus / lorry plastic air pipe and suitable press fit connectors, cheap as chips, will last forever. That's what I'll be doing.

Same as , as mentioned in this thread on the topic and also as mentioned I agree with the oppinions that rigid piping is not suitable and would be a lot less reliable with the vibrations involved + this is very old hat engineering with the modern flexible nylon & PTFE tubing / couplings available today.
Like Matthew; I will be replacing it with the reliable genuine part IF? still available when needed as having had 23years out of one of mine and 17 years out of the other (with a minor repair 2 years ago) I don't consider them ''a PSA cheapskate bodge to save some dosh''.

http://www.bxclub.co.uk/forum/viewtopic ... 17&start=0

[Defender110]

Usefull link;

http://www.beal.org.uk/hoses-tubing-fit ... at_30.html

I have a pack of these and keep some in the cars;

http://www.beal.org.uk/hoses-tubing-fit ... _1144.html

and some of this in 5mm and 3.2mm in case of emergenct repair;

http://www.beal.org.uk/hoses-tubing-fit ... _3122.html

[scooters]

Usefull link;

http://www.beal.org.uk/hoses-tubing-fit ... at_30.html

I have a pack of these and keep some in the cars;

http://www.beal.org.uk/hoses-tubing-fit ... _1144.html

and some of this in 5mm and 3.2mm in case of emergenct repair;

http://www.beal.org.uk/hoses-tubing-fit ... _3122.html

very useful links

#MULLEY - sorry, I don't buy the metal fatigue argument - brake pipes on normally suspended cars are routinely made up by diy'ers - so easy is this that it is quite difficult to buy the OEM part with some marques - any independent will make their own - provided you have the tools AND know how to use them there is no reason why there should be any premature faliure - in fact, my mind is often at rest as I know that the work I have done is of excellent quality. Brake lines are under high pressure with often fatal results in case of a faliure.

#Defender101 - by their very nature the 'rigid' octopus cannot follow the same route and junction set up as the rubber octopus - it will have to be bespoked for the car. Rigid brake pipes run to flexible parts even with the addition of a flexi hose - using a braided flexihose at the joints where flex is an issue would be the plan albeit a costly one. Similar arrangements are seen on big Lexuses and Rolls Royces.

[Defender110]

[#Defender101 - by their very nature the 'rigid' octopus cannot follow the same route and junction set up as the rubber octopus - it will have to be bespoked for the car. Rigid brake pipes run to flexible parts even with the addition of a flexi hose - using a braided flexihose at the joints where flex is an issue would be the plan albeit a costly one. Similar arrangements are seen on big Lexuses and Rolls Royces.

Well yes if you were going to use flexis where required that would eliminate the rigid pipe problem but as you say it would be costly and OTT for the low pressure LHM returns.
The main point I was trying to make is that the original IMHO is not the unrelible part it is often deemed to be, yes they became a problem on higher mileage cars or later in life but are they in reality a weak point? I also think the life span of an octopus needs to be measured in mileage rather than years as I do remember younger cars with high rep mileage needing replacement whilst much older cars with less private miles didn't?