Injectors?

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Oscar
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Injectors?

Post by Oscar » Fri Feb 17, 2006 10:08 am

Hi

Do I need to change my injectors?

I'm asking for several reasons:

The car has 175k on the clock and as far as I can tell, injectors are original. There is no receipts for new ones, despite a large collection of bills, MoT certs etc. The ones in place are rusty as hell.

Fuel consumption is pants at the moment. Straight D, no mixtures. After my "drive within the speed limit" experiment, when I got 560 from the tank, I'm now lucky to get 450.

I've noticed puffs of smoke from the exhaust. Greyish in the daytime, white at night in people's headlights. Is this excess fuel burning off?

And if I do change the injectors, is there anything I should be aware of? It looks relatively straightforward.....

Thanks guys

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Post by jeremy » Fri Feb 17, 2006 10:54 am

When mine were bad on my DTR Turbo (same as TZD - Roto-diesel pump) I had no noticeable revs increase on cold start and in fact the thing would 'hunt' at times when cold. the exhaust was rather smokey after a cold start and I had to change gear a lot as the engine was down on power.

Haynes diesel book has instructions - there may be some on this site. i had mine done by specialist diesel engineers who cleaned them ( a proper and recognised process) and it cost me no more than a set of new injectors would. I don't think there is anything particularily difficult but some washers need examining/replacing.

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Post by AlanS » Fri Feb 17, 2006 10:58 am

Why not just get them ultra sonically cleaned.

Can't speak for diesel injectors, but we had to buy a petrol one this week for a TZi that cost almost A$150 trade price, whereas you can buy a cleaner and DIY for about $65 or get them done professionally for around A$100 for the lot.
They also seem a bit like light globes; get a good 'un and it'll last forever, get a bad one and it can be faulty out of the packet, so a good clean might be a better as well as a cheaper option.


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Post by DavidRutherford » Fri Feb 17, 2006 11:09 am

Unfortunately you can't really clean diesel injectors.

What happens is that the face of the injector becomes eroded, and then the pintle no longer produces a homogenous spray (they spray all over the place, rather than a nice straight squirt.)

Get some exchange recon ones. They cost about £60-80 for a set of four, you need no more than a 27mm deep socket and a 17mm spanner to change them, (plus a set of sealing washers, fire seal washers and some new leak off pipe) and the difference in running can be quite startling.

The payback period for recon injectors will probably be no more than a few thousand miles.
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Post by Terry Brooks » Fri Feb 17, 2006 11:13 am

Hi,I had the injectors from my TZD checked at a local deisel specialist's,cost was minimal [something like £2 per injector] ....a whole lot cheaper than buying new 'un's in my case .....'cos they were all OK.
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Post by Oscar » Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:02 pm

Hmmm.

I've asked my local specialist about refurbing them, he says £36 per injector, whereas GSF sell new ones for £25. I don't know whether either of those prices include washers and pipes.

Certainly have a little less power than before.

Better not tell SWMBO :(
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Post by Jayboy » Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:20 pm

Couldn't see Turbo diesel injectors on GSF myself but they are £31.10 + VAT on Euro Car Parts.

I've got a brand new and unused set of 4 Bosch ones lying around that I've had for about 4 years if you want them at significantly less than that price.

Bought them to replace the ones on my old RD Turbo but then scrapped it soon afterwards. Always regretted doing that!
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Post by Oscar » Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:21 pm

Jayboy

That's a very kind offer but Alas! I have a Lucas pump.

O
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Post by tim leech » Fri Feb 17, 2006 2:41 pm

Starting my TZD from cold, it can miss a little for a second or two and chucks a some black smoke out of the back, if i switch the glowplugs on and off one time before I start it its fine, yet the glowplugs were renewed just before I bought it!

What should I do, on warmer days it doesnt do it! :shock:

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Post by DLM » Fri Feb 17, 2006 6:20 pm

Do I need to change my injectors?
Before you give this any more thought, put some injector cleaner though a tankful of fuel and then reassess the situation. You can either go for the proprietary brands, use paraffin (cheaper), or perhaps take Tom's recent suggestion of a small amount of unleaded (have a search) - all well mixed in a full tank of fuel, of course.
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Post by Stewart (oily!) » Fri Feb 17, 2006 7:02 pm

Ber very careful when removing injectors that may have been in there for a long time, I have seen them bring a lot of alloy from the head with them, ouch :(
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Post by Oscar » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:10 am

Some more information:

I have put a bottle of cleaner through recently and things temporarily improved but are now bad again.

Like Jeremy mentioned, I'm now getting poor cold starting and hunting - last night it was lumpy as hell and hunted for about 15 secs. In the last two weeks, it has been slightly reluctant to start - thinking about it for the first second or two, before getting going.

So, injectors it is then. At least SWMBO is 3000 miles away and can't complain :D
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Post by Mr B » Mon Feb 20, 2006 7:43 pm

Have you checked the heater plugs? One or more of these failing will give poor starting and a lumpy idle from cold. My method of checking them is remove the feed wire, then connect a thick piece of wire to the battery. Touch the other end on the threaded end of the heater plug. If you get a small spark, the plug is drawing current and should be working. No spark, the plug is duff. Not foolproof though, as I once had a plug that sparked but didn’t glow at the tip :roll: You can test heaters with a multimeter but that is too technical for simple me :oops:

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Post by DavidRutherford » Mon Feb 20, 2006 7:52 pm

Mr B wrote:You can test heaters with a multimeter but that is too technical for simple me :oops:
Not hard.

Disconnect 4-way connecting link from glowplugs.
Set your multimeter to resistance (ohms) scale 0-2
Poke one lead onto the cylinder head, and the other to the tang on the end of the glowplug being tested
Read off the resistance.

Anything over about 2 ohms and the plug is probably duff.
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Post by jeremy » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:16 pm

Glowplugs shouldn't make any difference at all after the first minute of running on 4 cylinders - whatever timer is fitted they've cut out by then.

jeremy