Engine transplants

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wobblytrials
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Engine transplants

Post by wobblytrials »

Hi, i'm not a very regular visitor here (apologies for that) but i've been running my bx nearly a year now (wanted one since i was a kid and now have a 19 TGD) the NA lump is a little on the lethargic side which isn't great as i'm quite regularly recovering cars and towing.

my question really is can you drop a 306/405 turbo diesel XUD engine in without too much messing about. I know the gearbox and mounts will line up, i was just concerned about running the hydraulic pump and i'm not sure of how much electronic engine management is used on the 306's. And i suppose is it worth doing?
Dollywobbler
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Re: Engine transplants

Post by Dollywobbler »

As you correctly point out, driving the hydraulic pump is the problem - but one that can be overcome. I think a Xantia engine makes the swap easier, as it already has a pulley for the pump IIRC, but I'm sure someone will confirm.

You'll get a massive boost in performance over the 1.9NA but bear in mind that in a BX, the turbo diesels had taller gearing to make motorway driving more pleasant. Having owned a 306 TD, I don't remember any electronic engine management - that came in with the HDi, which is a very different engine.
wobblytrials
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Re: Engine transplants

Post by wobblytrials »

Yeah I was planning on keeping the shorter NA box as i feel you don't have to work the engine as hard to keep the turbo spooled up, plus i'm usually on rural roads and the shorter box will help with towing. I did wonder about driving the pump off the crank end mounting in the air-con bracket area. only issue i see there is the belt speed will be twice what the pump should run at.

I totally forgot that the xantia uses the xud (actually i totally forgot that the xantia existed), i'm really a peugoet freak having had 205/309 and 405 gti/mi16s. the xantia way might be a better way to go.

Thanks for your help on that.
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mat_fenwick
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Re: Engine transplants

Post by mat_fenwick »

The Xantia (apart from the very early ones) had a different hydraulic system with the (different) pump driven by the alternator/AC belt. It does have the advantage that you don't have to blank off the hole at the gearbox end of the head for the vacuum pump though.

I fitted a Xantia engine to mine and used a BX cam to drive the original hydraulic pump. It was a fairly easy swap as I started with a TD and already had the larger radiator, stronger driveshafts etc. Vanny did the swap a good while ago from a NA to 1.9 TD and used the Xantia hydraulics, so if you search on here he put some information up recently.
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Re: Engine transplants

Post by BX Bandit »

You'll need intercooler, different BX TD specific rad (expensive), header tank, coolant hoses, injection pump and associated injectors. You could put your n/a camshaft in and run the hydraulics as is. Whole new exhaust system, you may find the clutch isn't strong enough. A TD has a stronger clutch and a different clutch operation mechanism and clutch cable. Different inlet manifold, different air filter & housing, different air intake, a different (short nose) bonnet with intercooler ducting in it

Pugs and cits started using electronics about P maybe early R reg, even though they weren't HDi.
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Re: Engine transplants

Post by Dollywobbler »

Blimey. My 306 was R plate so either just escaped electronics, or I never noticed them...
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mat_fenwick
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Re: Engine transplants

Post by mat_fenwick »

The electronics (which I forgot to mention) were AFAIK only for the immobiliser but I never studied them in great detail. I've fitted an early engine into a late ZX and the engine I removed had the steel box secured with tamperproof screws protecting the stop solenoid. We binned that engine so I never removed the cover but I suspect the immobiliser circuit simply received the signal from the keypad and opened the solenoid. Once you have removed the cover (should be easier to drill out the bolts with the engine out) you can just run the existing BX wire stright to the solenoid.

The Xantia engine relies on afterglow glow plug when starting - if the standard BX relay is used this cuts them when you stop cranking so the engine will be very rough for a minute or two. The Xantia relay keeps them on for a few minutes, unless the engine temperature is above 60(?) °C or the throttle is opened a certain extent. That will need a little extra wiring to sort it out.
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1993 1.9 TZD Turbo Estate
1996 3.9 V8 Discovery
1993 VW LT35 campervan
1985 Hyundai Stellar V8
2016 Hyundai iLoad
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