The ULTIMATE power steering thread
- sleepy0905
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- Citroen Sorceror
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- My Cars: 2003- Passe-Partout 1.9 TGD estate
2005 Grolliffe Tizzydee turbo estate and sundry other BXs and Grace, a CX TRD.
2008 to 2023 - all sorts of stuff, some interesting
2024. TxD 1.9D estate. 'Wheelybin' - x 12
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Tom: When you say sink, do you mean once the engine is switched off and the car is left to sink? Because mine sinks very very quickly....the whole thing is decked out within an hour.
One third of a three-spoke BX columnist team for the Citroenian magazine.
CCC BX registrar: The national BX register - click to submit a car!
1983(A) 16TRS (Rouge Valleunga)
1990(H) 16Valve (Rouge Furio)
CCC BX registrar: The national BX register - click to submit a car!
1983(A) 16TRS (Rouge Valleunga)
1990(H) 16Valve (Rouge Furio)
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- Citroen Sorceror
- Posts: 1266
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 8:51 pm
- Location: straddling the channel
- My Cars: 2003- Passe-Partout 1.9 TGD estate
2005 Grolliffe Tizzydee turbo estate and sundry other BXs and Grace, a CX TRD.
2008 to 2023 - all sorts of stuff, some interesting
2024. TxD 1.9D estate. 'Wheelybin' - x 12
DLM's car sinks on switch off but then his doseur leaks in the idle state and would flatten the accumulator in no time at all. I reckon that the problem is due to an excessive flow (Grit?scored valve body?) when the brakes are applied. The flow is from the operational return and should logically be very little, otherwise the tail would fall with the brakes held on
before the HC came in to correct it. It would then probably oscillate until the brakes were released. The Doseur is a bit of a pig to change on certain models and is often conveniently forgotten although it is one of the hardest used hydraulic components.
before the HC came in to correct it. It would then probably oscillate until the brakes were released. The Doseur is a bit of a pig to change on certain models and is often conveniently forgotten although it is one of the hardest used hydraulic components.
In the last 35,000 miles (admittedly over 7 years my TD Estate has had:
Off side strut - due to excessive leakage
Pump - wonderful for 4 months then the old problem of the light coming on occurred again. Power steering now worked properly and always has since.
Problem with light coming on - returned. Increasingly difficult to get the car to rise - possibly dropping when driven.
New Doseur fitted - after 3 weeks - no change at all.
Reconditioned FDV (By me) - no change.
Discovered non-return ball valve in accumulator could be re-seated - nice slow cycling - light still coming on.
Changed regulator - re-seated valve - no change.
Changed FDV back to original now assembled correctly - cured all problems apart from generally being a bit slow and sinking quite quickly.
New NS front strut - (leakage and siezure)
New pipe regulator to safety valve - not discovered on MOT - plastic bracket chafed through it! - dripping
As I say - the steering has always worked since I changed the pump.
Off side strut - due to excessive leakage
Pump - wonderful for 4 months then the old problem of the light coming on occurred again. Power steering now worked properly and always has since.
Problem with light coming on - returned. Increasingly difficult to get the car to rise - possibly dropping when driven.
New Doseur fitted - after 3 weeks - no change at all.
Reconditioned FDV (By me) - no change.
Discovered non-return ball valve in accumulator could be re-seated - nice slow cycling - light still coming on.
Changed regulator - re-seated valve - no change.
Changed FDV back to original now assembled correctly - cured all problems apart from generally being a bit slow and sinking quite quickly.
New NS front strut - (leakage and siezure)
New pipe regulator to safety valve - not discovered on MOT - plastic bracket chafed through it! - dripping
As I say - the steering has always worked since I changed the pump.
- docchevron
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I've got a good PR if you need it dude.
Dont think it's the brake valve, they just never fail (well very rarely)
I cant take the credit for the following but it makes sense to me at least. Your rear spheres are flat as, er, well, a flat thing!
Change them!
Cheers
Chris G
Dont think it's the brake valve, they just never fail (well very rarely)
I cant take the credit for the following but it makes sense to me at least. Your rear spheres are flat as, er, well, a flat thing!
Change them!
Cheers
Chris G
Smokes lots, because enough's enough already!
Far too many BX's, a bus, an ambulance a few trucks, not enough time and never enough cash...
Far too many BX's, a bus, an ambulance a few trucks, not enough time and never enough cash...
Ideally you would test everything with an appropriate pressure gauge - which would entail considerable dismantling if it was available.
So what is known?
What is the regulator cycling speed? If its more than 30 seconds its a fair guess that any leaks beyond the accumulator (brakes and suspension) aren't so great that they would prevent the steering working and that the fault lies before the regulator - ie lack of pump output or FDV. (or but extremely unlikely the steering pinion)
The return from the pinion valve should be continuous until the steering is turned - when it should cut off smartly. If that is happening it indicates at least some activity from the pinion valve. If it continues then it would suggest to me that the pinion valve seals have failed. Normally one side could be expected to fail before the other but as this car has been driven for some time without the PAS its possible that both seals have gone as both can reasonably be expected to fail at a similar time.
So what is known?
What is the regulator cycling speed? If its more than 30 seconds its a fair guess that any leaks beyond the accumulator (brakes and suspension) aren't so great that they would prevent the steering working and that the fault lies before the regulator - ie lack of pump output or FDV. (or but extremely unlikely the steering pinion)
The return from the pinion valve should be continuous until the steering is turned - when it should cut off smartly. If that is happening it indicates at least some activity from the pinion valve. If it continues then it would suggest to me that the pinion valve seals have failed. Normally one side could be expected to fail before the other but as this car has been driven for some time without the PAS its possible that both seals have gone as both can reasonably be expected to fail at a similar time.
- sleepy0905
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PAS
Kitch - I am right in thinking that yiu currently have no power steering at all or just when you hit h ebrakes?
Cheers
Luke
Cheers
Luke
- docchevron
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I found operating (straightening the wheels) the steering of a pas bx with the engine switched off, splits the rubber steering coupliing under the strain.docchevron1472 wrote:I believe it has no PAS at all, ever!
Still, nothing like keep fit steering to build those arms up and impress the ladeezzzz
1991 BX19GTi Auto
PAS
Well if it is dead at all times now I would have thought a good approach would be to check flow and return at the rack, pinion valve and ram.
With it being dead I would have suspected pinion valve or ram as Aaron suggested earlier but thankfully I have never had to delve into the LHM system on any citroen - YET!
Cheers
Luke
With it being dead I would have suspected pinion valve or ram as Aaron suggested earlier but thankfully I have never had to delve into the LHM system on any citroen - YET!
Cheers
Luke
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Good point Chris, the rear spheres are quite flat. I know that probably wouldn't affect the steering but they do need changing.
I'll go down Tom's route first, purely because the theory holds water and its seemingly an easy thing to check. If that fails, the FDV would probably be worth sorting again, although truth be told I've got about 3 in the garage...might just be worth rebuilding one? Or buying Aarons?
Jeremy: The PR clicks about every 11-12secs. With its current setup, it should be considerably longer between clicks I'd say. But interesting point about the pinion valve return, thats another thing I can check.
Aaron: Thats exactly what happened mate....it just died totally one night.
Tim: Yes, you noticed my secret....damn! If I said I wasn't once tempted to fit a manual rack I'd be lying
I'll go down Tom's route first, purely because the theory holds water and its seemingly an easy thing to check. If that fails, the FDV would probably be worth sorting again, although truth be told I've got about 3 in the garage...might just be worth rebuilding one? Or buying Aarons?
Jeremy: The PR clicks about every 11-12secs. With its current setup, it should be considerably longer between clicks I'd say. But interesting point about the pinion valve return, thats another thing I can check.
Aaron: Thats exactly what happened mate....it just died totally one night.
Tim: Yes, you noticed my secret....damn! If I said I wasn't once tempted to fit a manual rack I'd be lying
One third of a three-spoke BX columnist team for the Citroenian magazine.
CCC BX registrar: The national BX register - click to submit a car!
1983(A) 16TRS (Rouge Valleunga)
1990(H) 16Valve (Rouge Furio)
CCC BX registrar: The national BX register - click to submit a car!
1983(A) 16TRS (Rouge Valleunga)
1990(H) 16Valve (Rouge Furio)
- docchevron
- The Immoderate half of the admin team
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Like I said mate, it wasn't me that thought of it, however there is an explanation that goes with it. Makes sense to me, but your steerings been sha££ed for a while so I guess when it went the back end was ok??Kitch wrote:Good point Chris, the rear spheres are quite flat. I know that probably wouldn't affect the steering but they do need changing.
Cheers
Chris G
Smokes lots, because enough's enough already!
Far too many BX's, a bus, an ambulance a few trucks, not enough time and never enough cash...
Far too many BX's, a bus, an ambulance a few trucks, not enough time and never enough cash...