Would it be daft to.....

Ian_Fearn · Post by **Ian_Fearn** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 6:41 pm

convert my Rotodiesel injection system to a Bosch system?

M · Post by M » Wed Feb 06, 2008 7:30 pm

No, but I believe it would be a pain in the backside to do. Speak to Mr. B - IIRC he did this.

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 9:46 pm

I did just that on my Visa as the Lucas pump was reving up on it's own.

If you go to a breakers, make sure you get the pump, pipes and injectors from the same vehicle, it's then just a straight swop.

Use a bent paper clip or small magnet to lift the fire rings that sit under the injector nozzle.

ken newbold · Post by **ken newbold** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:20 pm

With all respect Brian, I think Ian's BX is a turbo diesel which would make the job much more complex.

Unless there is a problem with your existing pump, I'd leave well alone. If it's gone wrong then, maybe.

I've never had any luck changing from Lucas to Bosch. But Brian's idea is correct, make sure you get a matching set.

jeremy · Post by **jeremy** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 10:44 pm

Usual cause of a Lucas / Roto-diesel - CAV pump revving on its own is air in the fuel.

If its veg compatibility the seals can be changed for non-soluble ones - in any event it would seem the experience is that it takes some time (years?) for the seals to start to leak.

Post by **docchevron** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 3:29 am

Turbo or not it's easy enough.

As above, get the pipes and injectors too, and the pump bracket as the bosch and lucas brackets are different.
Also you'll need the intercooler "communicator" pipe that goes to the pump, as they be different, althoguh the Lucas one is longer, so you could just cut it down to fit the bosch pump.

Depending on year of car (ie seperate fuel filter or filter on top the stat housing ) it might be worth nabbing the fuel lines from the bulkhead too.
Other than that, an easy afternoons work.

Be sure to check the pump timing after, even if the pump comes attached to it's bracket, as the liklyhood of it being spot on is remote in the extreme.

Kevin B · Post by **Kevin B** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:05 am

You will not need the injector pump bracket, because it is drilled and tapped with additional holes (one set of holes suit the Bosch pump, the other set will suit the Lucas DPC pump). You just need to swap the position of the three studs.

You will however need additional water cooling pipework for the Bosch pump, as it uses an advance and retard feature which is controlled by cooling water temperature. Also needed is the special blanking plate on the cylinder head (front of cylinder head, timing belt end) where you pick up the supply of coolant, and the thermostat housing with an additional return port, where coolant is returned back to the main coolant circuit.

If your going from Lucas DPC to Bosch you will not need to change the waxstat cold start enrichment device, however if going from Bosch to Lucas DPC injector you will need to change this as the cable length is too short.

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 10:39 am

Usual cause of a Lucas / Roto-diesel - CAV pump revving on its own is air in the fuel.

I wish it was that simple, when I lifted the lid off the Lucas pump, it was full of metal swarf.

I did not even bother to strip the pump any further, as then time was a premium.

Following on, has any one fitted a Bosch turbo diesel pump to a N/A engine, or opinions appreciated on the how it may or may not function.

Post by **docchevron** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 2:11 pm

Kevin B wrote: You will however need additional water cooling pipework for the Bosch pump, as it uses an advance and retard feature which is controlled by cooling water temperature. Also needed is the special blanking plate on the cylinder head (front of cylinder head, timing belt end) where you pick up the supply of coolant, and the thermostat housing with an additional return port, where coolant is returned back to the main coolant circuit.

Not if you get a later pump with the electric cold start advance.

I've done a few now that had the water advance unit. I've either left them disconnected (which makes naff all difference), or removed it and fitted the later stylee electric unit, it's an easy thing to change.

Ian_Fearn · Post by **Ian_Fearn** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 5:08 pm

Has anybody got a turbo diesel they're breaking with this lot on?

tim leech · Post by **tim leech** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 5:33 pm

Is there any significant gain? seems alot of messing about if not surely?

citroen7 · Post by **citroen7** » Thu Feb 07, 2008 5:39 pm

is the 1.7td set up the same as the 1.9td ?
If the answer is yes then i could possibly help, i was going to keep this engine as a spare for the pug. but with the 4x4 arriving this may not be top of the list anymore.

Post by **docchevron** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 3:10 am

The 1.9TD pump will fit straight on a 1.7TD yes.

As Tim said though, TBH unless you're desperate to run quantities of the veg, then is it really worth the hassle?
If it aint broke and all that...

Kevin B · Post by **Kevin B** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:15 am

[quote="docchevron1472"]The 1.9TD pump will fit straight on a 1.7TD yes.

While the 1.9TD pump will fit straight on, it will always overfuel the engine as the base fueling is greater than the 1.7 TD pump

Hence you are likely to see more black smoke, and reduced MPG figures.

jeremy · Post by **jeremy** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:51 am

I'm curious - how can a diesel pump overfuel an engine? The diesel works on the principle of free air - which means that the air supply is unregulated - so more fuel - the more power it produces.

So at idle the speed would be too much - so slow the idle. At full throttle it might smoke - so adjust the throttle stop.

Where have I gone wrong?