17TZD failed indicators/heater blower a few more observtions

BX Tech talk
Post Reply
BillS
New Member
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 1:37 pm
Location: UK

17TZD failed indicators/heater blower a few more observtions

Post by BillS »

Firstly, what an excellent welcome! Obviously those who appreciate the finer points of an under-rated car like the BX are indeed a helpful lot.
The power windows are working, but thanks for the suggestion. I've fiddled the key endlessly, changed key etc. However, consistent with fuse two as the culprit, the instrument panel warning lights have failed too. I'd failed to spot this since obviously the car is undrivable without indicators. This might explain why the first obvious symptom, the alternator failure light, is now off. I'm going out now to check the wiring leading to fuse two in case a plug has worked loose. I also swapped all but the grey and brown relays with no effect, including those under the bonnet.
Thanks again to all those so willing to help.
Bill
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

Bill,

A welcome from me too. I don't post as much as I'd like to, other things get in the way.

This problem of yours. What you described is identical to that which I have on my BX. Changed everything, checked everything, still no panel lights, heater blower, indicators etc. Also, alternator not charging is displaying most of the time.

I posted last night, I recall something like this on a Massey tractor about 20 years ago, and I think it probably was the ignition barrel.

Doc is supplying me with a replacement, so if all else fails, I would put out a request to the boys on here. They're the most helpful and decent bunch of lads you could want to come across.

When I get my replacement fitted i'll post the results.

Curious, exactly the same fault ocured on my Landrover yesterday, stranding it and my wife thirty odd miles away from home. Repair estimate is of the order of £200!!!

Hang in at the forum Bill, it's a good place to be.

Best wishes

Terry
jeremy
Over 2k
Posts: 2112
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2005 2:58 am
Location: Hampshire UK

Post by jeremy »

If you suspect the key switch - have a good look at the wiring diagram in Haynes and see if a failure of one or more contacts would produce the failures you are experiencing.

Having got that far you should be able to confirm your findings by bridging connections in the plug and socket connecting the key switch to the loom.

I do wonder - as often seemingly unlinked and strange malfunctions turn out to be a earth return problem.
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

Cheers Jeremy, I check that tomorrow if I get a break. Will report back asap.
User avatar
DLM
Our Trim Guru
Posts: 1620
Joined: Mon May 16, 2005 6:41 pm
Location: Gosport, Hampshire, UK
My Cars: Historically, lots of BX hatches/estates in the 90s/00s - 16/19i/17td/19d
Recent scruffy diesel n/a estate - "The Red Shed" - is no longer mine.
x 9

Post by DLM »

.... and don't forget to seat everything securely on the interconnect box which the fuses sit at the bottom end of. I've experienced seemingly random electrical funnies a few times that have been caused by feet and my tendency to leave the the box in the "down" position.

If you have, or the car has had an alarm system, then be aware they can sometimes be right buggers in these circumstances.
Back on two wheels and pedal power for the moment.
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

OK, so the report as promised.

I've checked around as suggested and all seems to be fine - tested with screwdriver etc.,

Just managed to get the ignition barrel out of it's socket and surprise, surprise, it's got eight wires!!

Now, I've located a mini plug tucked right under the centre console and the other one seems to be buried out of sight much further down. I can't see if either plug has been re-jigged at some time to accommodate a barrel from another model but it wouldn't surprise me.

The Haynes manuals, both diesel and BX aren't, a lot of help since I can only locate six wires on them.

Any help really would be appreciated

Terry



But eight wires?
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

Bill,

Did you get your motor sorted.

Please do post or pm what the problem was. Got a real humdinger with my TXD.

Terry
User avatar
DLM
Our Trim Guru
Posts: 1620
Joined: Mon May 16, 2005 6:41 pm
Location: Gosport, Hampshire, UK
My Cars: Historically, lots of BX hatches/estates in the 90s/00s - 16/19i/17td/19d
Recent scruffy diesel n/a estate - "The Red Shed" - is no longer mine.
x 9

Post by DLM »

Will take a look at the circuit diagrams in the diesel-specific Revue Technique for the BX. They use essentially the same diags as in haynes but somehow they're easier to follow (e.g. the id numbers for the components/units correlate with an alphabetically sorted list of names in French).

Also there's the interconnects diagram, which is on available PDF somewhere - but the hard copy is very useful for some slightly more remote debugging than is possible otherwise.
Back on two wheels and pedal power for the moment.
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

Thanks DLM, any help is really gratefully received.

Terry
User avatar
DLM
Our Trim Guru
Posts: 1620
Joined: Mon May 16, 2005 6:41 pm
Location: Gosport, Hampshire, UK
My Cars: Historically, lots of BX hatches/estates in the 90s/00s - 16/19i/17td/19d
Recent scruffy diesel n/a estate - "The Red Shed" - is no longer mine.
x 9

Post by DLM »

All the relevant BX wiring diags I have show eight wires, not six : you also don't have to dismantle the barrel for checking. Any connection inlboard from the barrel that isn't a 4-way suggests something strange afoot, as this is where alarm installers tend to do their dirty business.

Will PM a suggestion. There is a relevant earth on the side of the steering column (if you've got this far in dismantling), and indicator problems may sometimes arise due to the lhs rear earth point behind the light cluster.
Back on two wheels and pedal power for the moment.
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

Thanks mate, this is now making sense.

I'll get to it in the morning - right now I have a stinking cold and the fresh air has got to be better than central heating.

Will report back
simonbx17
BXpert
Posts: 469
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:44 pm
Location: whitehall, bristol

/

Post by simonbx17 »

mine aswell does this, only when i've been on long journey's.

my battery light comes on and when i try and use my indicators they don't work and there is a loud buzzing from it's relay but this hasn't resulted in flat batteries.
i've tried replacemant relay's has not cured also tried replacing hazard switch but nothing, i was told by a ccc member that it might be a dodgy earth in the instrument pod?
mine too is a txd which at some point had a moss alarm fitted?!
Current.
00' Fraud Mondeo 2.0 ghia x......i know couldn't resist a bargain.
99' Peugeot 306 1.4 lx. nicely spec'd.
-----------------------------------------------------------
93' xm 2.1 turbo D saloon 203.000mls has been sold to "citroenxm".
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

Yeah, mine has a Moss alarm fitted too - or it will have up until tomorrow morning.

This is the first time I've been able to get onto this forum in six days, so if anyone has posted a reply to anything, my apologies for not replying. I only got on this time by following an email link.

Not having a moan, it's free and I appreciate the forum. Thanks.

I'm going to try my PM's now.
simonbx17
BXpert
Posts: 469
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:44 pm
Location: whitehall, bristol

!

Post by simonbx17 »

hi terry, i think there's a pattern forming here i didn't see if bills bx had a moss alarm? i've not seen my battery light for a while now but haven't been on a long trip yet.

it would be great if we could get a result on this one. i'll check my ignition switch at the weekend. also i forgot to mention sometimes i have to rock my key backwards and forwards i.e from accessories to the starter positons for my bx to start luckly i don't have to do this often doesn't happen often.
Current.
00' Fraud Mondeo 2.0 ghia x......i know couldn't resist a bargain.
99' Peugeot 306 1.4 lx. nicely spec'd.
-----------------------------------------------------------
93' xm 2.1 turbo D saloon 203.000mls has been sold to "citroenxm".
Terry
BXpert
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:31 am
Location: Tucked up in deeply rural Suffolk away from it all

Post by Terry »

Hi Simon, sounds like you've got the same problem I had.
Let me fill you in on what happened to me.

BX TXD estate bought from Phillip Chidlow last June (?) in excellent condition, superb runner. Went straight through the test in August no problems. Still does 60 mpg no matter what I do with it and 149k now on clock. Didn't think too much about it. Went on a fully loaded 250 mile round trip down M11 and alternator light was on and off-nasty with two grandchildren and wife on board on a horrible wet day. Made it home.

OK, enough history. During November the key was getting a little difficult to turn in the barrel but everything worked until on a freezing day in early January with six Windows PC repair calls to make car had no warning lights on first stage of ignition. Engine started but no brake lights, indicators, heater blower, indicator relay buzzing as you said, head lights dim. Perfect for night driving.

Put a request out on the forum and Doc sent an ignition outfit to me, but it got lost in the post. DLM posted me about some checks I could do to track down the fault. Everything he said came back as an ignition barrel failure.

Only yesterday tracked down a suitable barrel in Norwich having searched the net and been asked £97 for a new one (if they could find it!!!) This one cost me £20 with 2 keys. Fitted it today and the motor is now just perfect again.

Simon, if your motor is a TXD you'll need a new ignition barrel, key etc, but it MUST have 8 wires on it - 4 red, 4 white. Slip your barrel out, free it up a little and count the number of wires on yours. Most have just six.

They end under the centre console and are a b*gger to unplug from the main wiring. I can only suggest you put out a request on the forum for an 8 wire barrel before yours fails miles from anywhere. I tried something like 30 places on the net and got nowhere. Scrappies around Suffolk don't carry anything older than maybe a R plate - there's a load of snobs around here.

If you can't source one fairly quickly, PM me and I'll pull a couple of strings with a couple of guys in N. Norfolk 40 odd miles away. I heard they can source most anything from scrap motors.

Best of luck mate, and please keep me posted about how you get on.
Post Reply