Wheely good question

Post by **Tim Leech** » Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:11 am

I will have a spare set of 4 wider steels (no tyres sorry) in the next month or so when I get the Alloys fitted to the TRS, you are welcome to them Ian. They came off a 306.

Post by **mat_fenwick** » Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:56 pm

citronut wrote:if your suspesion is not quite working as it should

Hmmm, what do you think Ian? Is your suspension in top notch condition?

Dollywobbler · Post by **Dollywobbler** » Wed Nov 04, 2009 3:09 pm

Um, no comment... (creak, groan...)

It may need spheres and the rear suspension arm bearings are shot, but I'm not sure either of these would cause it to corner like the road has been greased. (well, it's not that bad, but not confidence inspiring on smooth, wet tarmac).

Tim - may very well be interested in the wheels. Cheers.

Post by **mat_fenwick** » Wed Nov 04, 2009 4:06 pm

I agree Ian, I would be sure that it's the tyres that are letting you down. When I bought the wheels for mine, even thought they were (briefly!) shod with some no-name rubber, I was pleased with the improvement in cornering speeds. I would have thought your rear arm bearings may have caused you a bit of 'stepping out' if you hit a bumpy section mid corner, but bizarrely they didn't feel as bad as they looked (from the comedy camber) when I was a passenger.

DavidRutherford · Post by **DavidRutherford** » Thu Nov 05, 2009 8:32 am

Mike E (uk) wrote:Any new tyres will be more grippy then worn out items of course

Only in the wet. A tyre with 1.0mm of tread left on it will actually handle better in the dry than a brand new one, as the tread blocks are more stable. Only when the road is wet will the tyre with decent tread depth be an advantage.

Ian_Fearn · Post by **Ian_Fearn** » Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:52 am

I can recommend Pirelli P6000's. They're not the most long lived tyre (20,000 miles out of my last set) but i got 4 from Black Circles for 120quid.

They were impressive enough driving through the Pyrenese earlier this year (had some fun on that trip)

Post by **docchevron** » Thu Nov 05, 2009 2:23 pm

DavidRutherford wrote:
Mike E (uk) wrote:Any new tyres will be more grippy then worn out items of course
Only in the wet. A tyre with 1.0mm of tread left on it will actually handle better in the dry than a brand new one, as the tread blocks are more stable. Only when the road is wet will the tyre with decent tread depth be an advantage.

This is truth.

It's also the case that worn tyres have less rolling resistance than new, hence save some fuel.
OK, it's marginal, but enough to make the bus company switch back to using part worn tyres on the rear, since across group they reckon it'll save one half million pounds a year in fuel!

Dollywobbler · Post by **Dollywobbler** » Thu Nov 05, 2009 4:22 pm

Anyone got any experience of Avons? I had a Pug 306 DT a few years ago. It was shod with Goodyears and would wheelspin in third in the wet. Ditched 'em for a pair of Avons and the change was remarkable. Absolutely planted.

douglas851 · Post by **douglas851** » Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:40 pm

I have Avon ZV3 on my 16v. Brilliant tyre, wet or dry, no idea of wear rate as they have only been on for a few hundred miles.

Douglas.

Vanny · Post by **Vanny** » Thu Nov 05, 2009 6:38 pm

Ian_Fearn wrote:I can recommend Pirelli P6000's.

I can't, they are horrendous on the missus Corsa (185/50 r15 i think), anything but dry dry roads and they start squirming, absolutley no traction what so ever in snow/ice. Great for hand brake turns though.

Same car now has Michelin Energy 2 all round, ride is the same, grip is better in the damp, road noise like for like is increased. But they are nitrogen filled which makes them much better at everything.

Post by **docchevron** » Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:41 am

I rate Avons, never used them myself, but my mates ZX Volcane was shod with Avon Z (er something or other, could have been ZV's..) and they gripped very well in the dry, and almost as well in the wet. Wear rate was higher than Uniroyals though..

Never understood why anyone uses Pirelli's TBH.
They aint all that cheap for what is little more than a Billy Budget.
K's 205 came equipped with Pirelli's. They were utter shite, P6000's.

Her old XR2 had Pirelli's aswell, I changed them all before I'd let her drive it. Less grip than a Mr. Sheen polished wood veneer table covered in KY jelly..

Ian_Fearn · Post by **Ian_Fearn** » Fri Nov 06, 2009 12:08 pm

Vanny wrote:
Ian_Fearn wrote:I can recommend Pirelli P6000's.
I can't, they are horrendous on the missus Corsa (185/50 r15 i think), anything but dry dry roads and they start squirming, absolutley no traction what so ever in snow/ice. Great for hand brake turns though.

Same car now has Michelin Energy 2 all round, ride is the same, grip is better in the damp, road noise like for like is increased. But they are nitrogen filled which makes them much better at everything.

I clearly dont drive it hard enough

My missus BX has Mich Energy's (175's i think) and they're not a patch on the 185 P6000's on mine.

Linegeist · Post by **Linegeist** » Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:29 pm

docchevron1472 wrote:Less grip than a Mr. Sheen polished wood veneer table covered in KY jelly..

One for the 'use again' notebook methinks.

FWIW (and not wishing to teach any grannies to fellate ouefs), could it be that the tyres Dollywobbler has fitted are maybe getting on a bit?

The reason I ask this, is that tyres tend to lose a whole shedload of their designed-in properties with age - my French BX Mk1 was owned by an old gent who'd done about 700 km a year in it for for the preceding 8 years - with the result that the Michelin tyres fitted were virtually new. However, the damned things were rock hard and slid like turds in treacle whenever it rained (a lot near Versailles). In short, they'd age hardened and lost all their grip.

After several heart-stopping episodes on wet bends, when the effing things broke away at about 50kph and the bloody car suddenly developed all the handling characteristics of a buggered surfboard, I got the hint and ditched 'em (they were in lovely nick too

) and fitted new ones - prob solved.

I ran Michelin Energys on my TZD and the Athena has 'em on the front - and they seem fine, at least for the geriatric speeds I drive at, if a bit rumbly.

HTH

MULLEY · Post by **MULLEY** » Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:09 pm

Bob, you've hit the nail on the head, the age of tyres (even if they visually look ok) does have an affect on how they perform. Caravan owners are well known for changing their tyres on their caravans even if the tyres have done sod all mileage & the condition looks like new. When it comes to car tyres, no ones seems to be of the same opinion

Rubber & its various compounds degrade. I personally will not use tyres that are more than 5 years old, regardless of condition & tread depth, i value my life a lot more than a few quid saved by not changing my tyres.

There was a previous thread not that long about about tyres which covered various aspects of degradation/performance etc...may well be worth having a search for it to avoid covering old ground.

Dollywobbler · Post by **Dollywobbler** » Fri Nov 06, 2009 2:23 pm

I did think about this but while the old boy who previously owned it certainly wasn't going crazy with the mileage, the history seemed to suggest that it had still been clocking up some miles. In fact, I've a feeling that at least one pair of tyres was not that old at all. Maybe I need to investigate further - might be worth lobbing the freshest looking pair on the front if they're not there already - they're all the same make.