No indicators etc

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andycadabra
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Re: No indicators etc

Post by andycadabra » Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:21 pm

Thanks for elucidating me a little, Tinkley. I'm not quite sure how to test the indicator relay as I don't have a spare one. I read earlier in this thread that the indicators are on the same circuit as the heater which also not working. The breakdown guy just relied on trial and error to figure out which wires were which - by doing this do you think he might have blown the indicator relay? Does the fact that I was getting a buzz coming from the fuse box when I used the indicator mean anything, do you think?
Andy, thanks for the word about the one on eBay, I think I had seen that, however its in Poland, and according to the picture doesn't seem to have as long a lead is mine needs to be, plus it only seems to have six wires attached if you look at the plugs (perhaps mine has an extra two because of the immobiliser?) . I do have a spares car, if I can get to it, a mark 2, so with luck that will fit, but I will still have to either reach the connectors, which seem to be inaccessible on my car, or cut the wires and rejoin them, in which case I'll need to know which wire does what, and don't know where to start on that. Do you think an auto electrician would be able to sort it out?
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1987 BX 16TRS SORN

Mothman

Re: No indicators etc

Post by Mothman » Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:46 pm

In order to change the barrel. you will have to remove the plastic shroud from around the steering wheel and disconnect the connectors and pull the whole lot through the steering barrel holder. If you have a donor motor, then thats the one to practice on and then repeat the process on your main motor. However, if the lock has collapsed then its another matter. Dont cut the wires, it will fit. I had the indicators fail on my TGD in September, it was just the case of replacing the relay in the fuse box. It made a click but wouldnt work, i felt it click when indicator turned so just replaced it from a spare fuse box. Both jobs are fiddly but should be well within average ability. I certainly managed all easy enough.

Andy

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by andycadabra » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:30 pm

Thanks for the extra info, Andy. There isn't anything left of the original ignition barrel - it had to be chiselled out. I've just made some progress in as much as I managed to bend back the panel of the centre console on the passenger side in order to see where the two connectors are, which is about a foot behind the radio, so I should be able to reconnect, although I might have to add a few inches to each wire, as mine will need to be about 2 feet. I've read that there are three types of ignition barrel used on the BX and that none are interchangeable, which is a bit of a worry. I'm expecting the one from my donor car to have only six wires, as most of them seem to be like this. I imagine that the extra two on mine are perhaps for the immobiliser? - not sure what to do about those. In theory an additional single switch should solve the problem if I can figure out how to wire it.
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1987 BX 16TRS SORN

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by Mothman » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:35 pm

If your motor has ABS then the extra wires will probably be for that.

Andy

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by andycadabra » Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:07 pm

I does have ABS actually. Any idea what to do about them? one should be red and the other, white.
1992 BX 17TZD 130k
1987 BX 16TRS SORN

Mothman

Re: No indicators etc

Post by Mothman » Thu Jan 22, 2015 9:19 pm

You will need a barrel for ABS then. Ime sure that if you just fit one without ABS, the light will come on permanently and thats an mot fail.
Rob Moss at Chevronics is breaking a TD Estate at the moment, perhaps thats got one. Worth contacting him.

Andy

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David
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Re: No indicators etc

Post by David » Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:26 pm

All the red wires are 12V live. If you so wish these can all be connected together.

There are 4 white wires. 1 is for some accessories (pos 1), another is for more accessories (pos 2)
another is for the ignition (pos 3), & the 4th is for the starter.

In order to have the cars electrical circuits working normally (without the ignition barrel) then 3 of the white wire need to be connected to the red wires, leaving just the white starter wire disconnected when running.

Some cars only have 6 wires, in this instance then there is only 2 live wires & 4 positions as per the other type with 8 wires.

The plugs (on right hand drive cars) are just behind the heater. If you pull the centre console out, then you'll be able to see them with no problem.

It shouldn't make a difference if your car has ABS or not, as the ABS connects directly to the fuse box & NOT the ignition wires. (although I could be wrong on this matter).

If the heater & red warning lights work, but not the indicators, then you can start suspecting the flasher box. Otherwise I would assume its OK.

From what I have seen, you can replace a 8 wired ignition barrel with a 6, with no problems. Otherwise you can do a little rewiring. The BX electrical system is easy enough to work on.

Hope that helps.
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1992 Citroën BX 1.9 TXD (with GTI engine; Mulleys old car) - Parts car.

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by andycadabra » Thu Jan 22, 2015 11:49 pm

Thanks, David for that really useful information. I don't know too much about electrics, so I'm just a bit wary about connecting either of the two remaining white ones to the bunch of red ones since I measured 12 V between the white ones and the red ones, and common sense tells me that connecting them would cause a short circuit and blow a fuse?.
Andy, thanks for the tip on the BX TD being broken - it looks like I might not need the ignition from them, but I'm sure I can think of some other things I need.
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Re: No indicators etc

Post by Tinkley » Fri Jan 23, 2015 8:19 am

There is also a barrel from one Forum member available in the relevant For Sale Bits section. As I believe this is from a 16v it will be an ABS equipped car. Having changed a barrel on the 14 (attempted theft) and having extracted the barrel after the local 'repair centre' (Insurance insistence) f***ed the barrel breaking the key in it so it works hanging loose and turning the plastic bar, the barrel is pretty easy to change. One pin to depress if I remember right, a lot easier than snapped swan necked bolts... :wink:

When I have had water in the Fusebox (several reasons on 2 cars) I have had a buzzing from the wiper relay. When drained and dry the buzzing has gone!. Worth checking that the fusebox is actually dry, it can get wet from several causes so ignore those for now.

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by andycadabra » Fri Jan 23, 2015 12:09 pm

Thanks Tinkley - I sent him a PM. it's been quite dry here lately so I don't think dampness is the problem especially as the problem started after the breakdown guy messed around with the wiring in order to hotwire.
Do you have any thoughts on my previous post?, regarding connecting together white wire, with the red ones when there seems to be 12 V between them? . it'd be really useful if I can get the indicators working in order to use the car tomorrow night
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Re: No indicators etc

Post by Tinkley » Fri Jan 23, 2015 4:08 pm

I should be able to get a look at my old car tomorrow - it still has the working barrel part minus key stuff. All the wiring is intact into the switch, but hopefully gives some clue. It' s a '91 16 TGS so no ABS but otherwise should be as per yours.

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by andycadabra » Sat Jan 24, 2015 2:25 pm

Problem solved! I was worried about connecting up the white wires to the bunch of red ones but in the event I didn't need to. I connected up the 2 remaining white wires with the remaining red one (using the third position on the light switch) and indicators, instrument panel lights and heater now work. My immobiliser key which has sat uselessly in its socket for years is my new car key, and the light switch does the rest. I'll decide what to do about the barrel when I find out this week how many keys I have for my spares car - at least I can now drive to it. Thanks to everyone for the help.
1992 BX 17TZD 130k
1987 BX 16TRS SORN

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by Mothman » Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:07 pm

Result, well done bud.

Andy

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Re: No indicators etc

Post by andycadabra » Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:14 pm

David kindly sent the following information via a PM. It could be very useful to many of us..
The BX doesn't have fuses on the ignition wires, so if you cause a short it can be dangerous.

If your unsure if something is a live out (as in the case for the ignition wires) or a neutral, then something can be connected between the two wires (such as a 12V light), then if its a neutral the light will come on brightly, if its a live out, then it will come on dimly & whatever the wire goes to will also come on dimly.

That's a simple way to work them out & it stops potentially dangerous shorts.
1992 BX 17TZD 130k
1987 BX 16TRS SORN