BX 19GT PROBLEM NO MORE!

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Tim Leech
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Location: Burton on Trent
My Cars: 1963 VW BEETLE 1200 KGJ413A
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL BFA720L
1979 Rover SD1 3.5 V8-S TSL 982
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL DBV468W
1985 CITROEN BX 19GT C1TBX
1991 CITROEN BX 19TZI AUTO A/C BXi 19
1994 CITROEN XANTIA 1.8 SXi M908HRY
2002 Rover 75 CDT Connossieur SE Nav Auto R40TSL
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL L33CHT
x 70

Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tim Leech » Tue Feb 16, 2016 9:13 am

The car drove superbly as always before hand.
1963 VW BEETLE 1200
1985 BX 19GT Mk1
1991 BX 19TZI Auto A/C
1994 Xantia 1.8i SX
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL
1979 Rover SD1 V8-S
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL
2002 Rover 75 CDTi Connossieur SE AUTO Nav
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL 5 DR

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Kitch
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Kitch » Tue Feb 16, 2016 9:40 am

Just spray the coil with WD40 or something else cold and see if it makes a difference. I'll eat my hat if it does, but it's an easy way to check the coil out.

Tinkley
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tinkley » Tue Feb 16, 2016 11:35 am

On my 16 the failure was 'out of range' type unlike the 14 coils. So perfect start and run but slightly down on power. WD or similar won't make a jot of difference I'm afraid if that is the type of failure. However if you stopped after 1/2 mile no restart. Let it cool fully and perfect. You'd think it was carb but not so as I found out eventually after two carb strips and rebuilds, HT lead swapping etc etc. I'd still clean the carb on the 19 first mind you Tim.

Also maybe check the underside of the ignition module is properly grounded. It should be whistle clean and have thermal paste. Worst thing is the routing of the air duct from exhaust manifold chafing on the module lead... :wink:

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Tim Leech
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Posts: 15201
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Burton on Trent
My Cars: 1963 VW BEETLE 1200 KGJ413A
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL BFA720L
1979 Rover SD1 3.5 V8-S TSL 982
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL DBV468W
1985 CITROEN BX 19GT C1TBX
1991 CITROEN BX 19TZI AUTO A/C BXi 19
1994 CITROEN XANTIA 1.8 SXi M908HRY
2002 Rover 75 CDT Connossieur SE Nav Auto R40TSL
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL L33CHT
x 70

Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tim Leech » Tue Feb 16, 2016 12:03 pm

I've ordered a new ducellier coil so will fit that anyway, as the originals 31 years old. I am leaning towards a fuelling problem.
1963 VW BEETLE 1200
1985 BX 19GT Mk1
1991 BX 19TZI Auto A/C
1994 Xantia 1.8i SX
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL
1979 Rover SD1 V8-S
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL
2002 Rover 75 CDTi Connossieur SE AUTO Nav
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL 5 DR

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Kitch
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Kitch » Tue Feb 16, 2016 12:27 pm

Tim Leech wrote:I've ordered a new ducellier coil so will fit that anyway, as the originals 31 years old. I am leaning towards a fuelling problem.
It definitely sounds like a fuelling problem. I'd be rebuilding the carb. It's a healthy thing to do anyway as they really drag the power down if they're not running right. My Dad's GT felt like it went ok, until we stuck it on the dyno and it only mustered 70-odd bhp :lol: Probably felt like it went ok as up until 4000rpm it was fine, but after that it died off. All very well saying "Yeah but I never rev that high", but if there is a problem it won't fix itself, and it will work it's way back down the rev band.

I seem to remember yours also suffered on that dyno night we did Tinkley? Running lean and giving low figures?

Tinkley
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tinkley » Tue Feb 16, 2016 4:35 pm

That's right mine gave 72 brake which was actually a bit lower than expected after only about 65k. However motor had sat in other car for four years, turned over occassionally, but not going anywhere. I seem to remember it reved up fine, and power was a similar curve shape to that expected, just lower with a lot of difference in the two runs low down. This is most likely as you say down to fuelling in some way. It's got a lot more poke than the other 1.6 that Athena 2 (which is the one you had on the dyno but with the recon '04 engine in), but that's done 156k smokes and is definitely gutless. I don't doubt a complete head rebuild, maybe new rings, big end shells, etc would sort it for another 100k though.
Engine feels reasonable in the auto, certainly comparable to the motor on the dyno but of course it's hardly been thrashed. Probably never seen 4k revs it's entire life. Smokes a bit but that's the 25 year old valve stem seals. All XU52C engines 2 manual one auto, all Solex Z1-32-34 carbs.

I think there's a little more in the motor with some careful carb set up work, but don't expect more than about 80 or so. If it had four carbs, (or modern fuel inj), individual coil packs and a slightly different exhaust (truly tuned pipe lengths) it would give quite a bit more. Last January I gave some test 'Freelander/Range Rover/Evoque' prototypes a very hard time on the road about 30 miles outside Coventry. I don't think they thought a BX could actually move or corner quite so quickly, though eventually on a long straight they pissed off. Not often I go over 5k revs but hell the motor was very warm and the road half decent....I suspect they thought it was a GTi or 16v..lol. I was not even going to try with the paddle shift Porsche (with huge racing adjustable rear wing) near Silverstone... :wink:

Compared to the old 150C 14 though all of these are more powerful, definitely more torquey. I got 43 mpg (genuine) when towing to Italy and back when the first Athena had the recon (Vege) in it, 4m boat on trailer over the Alps not through a tunnel... :wink: and 50 mpg about three years later on a Liverpool round trip at constant 70mph.

These XU petrol lumps are supposed to do 200-250k before requiring a total overhaul. I was impressed the 150C did 175k with only one major bit of work head skim and gasket stuff. Mind you she was pretty oil leaky at the end... :wink:

One thing I have noticed with these Solex is the 'trip' for the second choke. This can be altered vis the factory set painted (red?) to prevent tampering, screw. I altered this an absolute minute fraction of a turn to ensure the second butterfly opened correctly. I don't doubt it was spot on when it left the factory as I only moved it less than 5 degrees. Worth a check, though I believe if you have a manometer you can set this even more accurately with that. The difference on the road is a smoother transition from single to both chokes and eliminating (or almost) any stuttering or hesitation. You can feel the difference quite easily so be very careful messing with that screw setting ie keep a good note of the factory original before moving IF you need to move it far. Sometimes the hesitation is due to the slightly poor heat isolation of the manifold to carb but it's hard to move it elsewhere... :wink:

Change over point (1.6) from single to twin is around 3,500/700 rpm or indicated 75/80mph on the level. If you keep under this point the economy is very good, but nice to get a smooth transition for when you need it. Not sure where the 1.9 transitions but similar principle.

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Tim Leech
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Posts: 15201
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Burton on Trent
My Cars: 1963 VW BEETLE 1200 KGJ413A
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL BFA720L
1979 Rover SD1 3.5 V8-S TSL 982
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL DBV468W
1985 CITROEN BX 19GT C1TBX
1991 CITROEN BX 19TZI AUTO A/C BXi 19
1994 CITROEN XANTIA 1.8 SXi M908HRY
2002 Rover 75 CDT Connossieur SE Nav Auto R40TSL
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL L33CHT
x 70

Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tim Leech » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:59 pm

Carb will be coming off this week and going off for a strip and rebuild.
1963 VW BEETLE 1200
1985 BX 19GT Mk1
1991 BX 19TZI Auto A/C
1994 Xantia 1.8i SX
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL
1979 Rover SD1 V8-S
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL
2002 Rover 75 CDTi Connossieur SE AUTO Nav
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL 5 DR

User avatar
Tim Leech
Over 2k
Posts: 15201
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Burton on Trent
My Cars: 1963 VW BEETLE 1200 KGJ413A
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL BFA720L
1979 Rover SD1 3.5 V8-S TSL 982
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL DBV468W
1985 CITROEN BX 19GT C1TBX
1991 CITROEN BX 19TZI AUTO A/C BXi 19
1994 CITROEN XANTIA 1.8 SXi M908HRY
2002 Rover 75 CDT Connossieur SE Nav Auto R40TSL
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL L33CHT
x 70

Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tim Leech » Tue Feb 16, 2016 7:10 pm

I'll order a rebuild kit, do we know model solex it is please chaps?
1963 VW BEETLE 1200
1985 BX 19GT Mk1
1991 BX 19TZI Auto A/C
1994 Xantia 1.8i SX
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL
1979 Rover SD1 V8-S
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL
2002 Rover 75 CDTi Connossieur SE AUTO Nav
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL 5 DR

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Kitch
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Kitch » Wed Feb 17, 2016 12:24 am

Solex Z1 or Z2. Same rebuild kit either way.

mds141
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by mds141 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 1:51 am

I seem to remember that Malcolm Lockwood has some Solex rebuild kits at the Northern Rally. Not sure if he's off loaded all his stock to Rob Moss yet. Might be worth giving Chevronics a bell.
Mark Smith

Is it just me or is everything shit?

1989 BX GTi 16 valve. Blanc Alpine. Completed the Citroen Classic Challenge Ecosse and 1337 miles without a hitch.
2000 XM VSX 2.1 td Auto. Rouge Magenta.
TGD saloon many years ago.

1990 Swift 'Corniche' 12/2 aka BXClub HQ.
Honda Firestorm. Gone, but not forgotten.
2015 Triumph Tiger Explorer XC.

Tinkley
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tinkley » Wed Feb 17, 2016 6:04 am

I think I got mine from Gower and Lee? who may still have some kits. They were also extremely knowledgeable and helpful.

Believe it or not there maybe some brand NOS complete carbs out there, certainly were about 4 or 5 years ago.

Be aware of the left hand thread (nut) holding the autochoke lever stuff. The nut should have a small groove around the middle of the hex outers. Otherwise fairly straight forward. AFAIK the early Haynes (brown cover 'til 87) has more section views of the carb than the later (shitty paper) blue one which covers to 94..... :wink:

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Tim Leech
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Posts: 15201
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Burton on Trent
My Cars: 1963 VW BEETLE 1200 KGJ413A
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL BFA720L
1979 Rover SD1 3.5 V8-S TSL 982
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL DBV468W
1985 CITROEN BX 19GT C1TBX
1991 CITROEN BX 19TZI AUTO A/C BXi 19
1994 CITROEN XANTIA 1.8 SXi M908HRY
2002 Rover 75 CDT Connossieur SE Nav Auto R40TSL
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL L33CHT
x 70

Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tim Leech » Wed Feb 17, 2016 9:06 am

Thanks chaps, I will fire an email to Rob Moss
1963 VW BEETLE 1200
1985 BX 19GT Mk1
1991 BX 19TZI Auto A/C
1994 Xantia 1.8i SX
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL
1979 Rover SD1 V8-S
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL
2002 Rover 75 CDTi Connossieur SE AUTO Nav
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL 5 DR

User avatar
Kitch
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Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 9:36 pm
Location: Fareham, Hants
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Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Kitch » Wed Feb 17, 2016 9:37 am

This is the kit you need:

Image

Job done:

Image

User avatar
Tim Leech
Over 2k
Posts: 15201
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Burton on Trent
My Cars: 1963 VW BEETLE 1200 KGJ413A
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL BFA720L
1979 Rover SD1 3.5 V8-S TSL 982
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL DBV468W
1985 CITROEN BX 19GT C1TBX
1991 CITROEN BX 19TZI AUTO A/C BXi 19
1994 CITROEN XANTIA 1.8 SXi M908HRY
2002 Rover 75 CDT Connossieur SE Nav Auto R40TSL
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL L33CHT
x 70

Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tim Leech » Wed Feb 17, 2016 5:23 pm

Cheers, I've ordered one, aswell as a new coil, rotor arm, plugs, and dizzy cap, she's had fuel pump and filters so should all be good!
1963 VW BEETLE 1200
1985 BX 19GT Mk1
1991 BX 19TZI Auto A/C
1994 Xantia 1.8i SX
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL
1979 Rover SD1 V8-S
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL
2002 Rover 75 CDTi Connossieur SE AUTO Nav
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL 5 DR

User avatar
Tim Leech
Over 2k
Posts: 15201
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Burton on Trent
My Cars: 1963 VW BEETLE 1200 KGJ413A
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL BFA720L
1979 Rover SD1 3.5 V8-S TSL 982
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL DBV468W
1985 CITROEN BX 19GT C1TBX
1991 CITROEN BX 19TZI AUTO A/C BXi 19
1994 CITROEN XANTIA 1.8 SXi M908HRY
2002 Rover 75 CDT Connossieur SE Nav Auto R40TSL
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL L33CHT
x 70

Re: BX 19GT PROBLEMS

Post by Tim Leech » Tue Feb 23, 2016 9:26 pm

New coil fitted, the problem persists, carbs off and ready to be rebuilt.

Bugger.
1963 VW BEETLE 1200
1985 BX 19GT Mk1
1991 BX 19TZI Auto A/C
1994 Xantia 1.8i SX
1972 Morris Marina 1.8 SDL
1979 Rover SD1 V8-S
1980 Morris Marina 1.7HL
2002 Rover 75 CDTi Connossieur SE AUTO Nav
2003 Rover 25 1.6i XL 5 DR