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BX Tech talk
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Post by MULLEY »

Oh go on someone supercharge something for us to have a go in.
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Post by Kitch »

Mazda did a supercharged diesel back in 1994. It was shite. :lol:
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Post by Stewart (oily!) »

My Bro had a comprex supercharged Mazda diesel comprex is not true supercharging, but it kept up with his 2.1 406 fine.
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Post by docchevron »

The supercharger idea is good in theory but.... Having a turbo and supercharger is probably the way to go (VW have achieved greatr results in petrols doing this).

I still say that if you spend ALONG time getting the right turbo and pump setup a 17TD will give a 8V GTi a good run for it's money. Mine would burn the 16V up to about 85MPH.

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Post by Kitch »

docchevron1472 wrote:The supercharger idea is good in theory but.... Having a turbo and supercharger is probably the way to go (VW have achieved greatr results in petrols doing this).

I still say that if you spend ALONG time getting the right turbo and pump setup a 17TD will give a 8V GTi a good run for it's money. Mine would burn the 16V up to about 85MPH.

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Your 16v is broken :P
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Post by docchevron »

Kitch wrote:
Your 16v is broken :P
Hell no mate! The valvers a flyer! So was the TD, untill it died! That was the problem, I was getting valver performance from a diesel and eventually it said "BU**ER OFF, I'VE HAD ENOUGH!"

But it'll fly again soon with even bigger turbo!! :roll:

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Post by BX Bandit »

erm..what about a 2.1td lump in a bx. I guess its a bit heavier but could/should it be done.....docchev?
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Post by docchevron »

It's been done! Yeah I like the 2.1 engine and maybe one day I'll have a go but I like the 17 too. Ok I could tune a 21 to get silly horsepower but I was getting more power from the 17....
Horses for courses I guess. The 17's a sweet engine when it works :cry: :roll:

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Post by BX Bandit »

Be it on your own head but if you want to try something that really really does make a difference both sheer pulling and throttle response wize then a 2-1 bosch pump and injectors does the job.
How easy is this to do? I swapped from roto to bosch so had to swap injectors, hp fuel pipes, sprocket, additional coolant feed for silly timing advance device that never works :x but that was about it. Is it the same as above or more involved? I thought there were electical gubbins involved (emu???)
Any idea of what power you were chucking out?
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Post by tim leech »

VW have the TSi engine which is a 1.4 with supercharger and turbo, 170bhp! will still do 40mpg and the emissions are quite low, Impressive but the 170bhp Tdi is quicker through the gears when on boost but alot noisier.
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Post by docchevron »

BX Bandit wrote: How easy is this to do? I swapped from roto to bosch so had to swap injectors, hp fuel pipes, sprocket, additional coolant feed for silly timing advance device that never works :x but that was about it. Is it the same as above or more involved? I thought there were electical gubbins involved (emu???)
Any idea of what power you were chucking out?
Er, right. If you get a pump froma S1 XM that is mechanical so is nearly a straight swap. S2 XM's were fly by wire so a little more complex... Still doable though.

All you need is the pump and the injectors. Re-use the inj. pipes from the pump you got already. The 21 pump we had on dad's had the water controlled advance arm on the front of the pump but I have seen XM's with the electrovalve....

We never dyno'd the car so I have no idea how much BHP she was putting out but it went like the clappers of hell! The power delivery was immediate and seemless and worked well with the turbo without playing about with the boost. It was at least as good as mine (before I trashed it) but without spending loads of cash on bigger turbo's and high list cams...

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Post by BX Bandit »

Sounds simple enough then dude, I might just have to tinker. Tempting....very tempting. Anybody got one? :lol:
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Post by BX Bandit »

Would a 1.9td pump work (xantia/zx/306) and give a bit more? Just thinking a 2.1 may kill a 1.7td quite quickly (perhaps not as quickly as your died Doc!! :lol: ). The other reason I was thinking a 1.9td is that are bound to be easier to find from scrappies - I'm guessing this series 1 2.1 pump may be difficult to find???
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Post by docchevron »

Indeed! XM pumps are not difficult to come across but they tend to be expensive.

Other than the 19TD bosch pump being slightly later theres little difference.
Although I've never seen a 19TD with the coolant operated advance arm, I think they were all electrovalve?

Again though, unless it's an early ish 306/ Synergie/ 806 / ZX you may find it has a load of electrical crap on the top of the pump, all tied in with the immobiliser. Steer clear of them!

IMHO mate, A standard Bosch pump should give you all the power the engine can handle, and then some, it's all a matter of spending some time setting it up the way you want it.
If you really want massive power, persuade your better half that you really need a 16v!!!!

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Chris G
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Post by jeremy »

Its not the volume of fuel that's important here, but the pressure. The suggestion is that the 2.1 pump produces a higher injection pressure than a 1.7 or 1.9 one - and therefore better atomisation is achieved.

In fact I think the principal improvement in diesels over the last 30 years or so has been the increase in injection pressures, rising to the enormous pressures used in the HD1's. A 1.7 runs at about 1100 - 1200 psi, and an HDi will run at 10,000 or so.

Finer atomisation means that the droplets burn quicker, and so produces less waste - in the form of soot. This means that more fuel can be pumped in before the onset of black smoke.