Mulley

[MULLEY]

Actually i have sent some of the algae off this car to NASA, who have verified that not only is it alien green dna, but the owner clearly has been smoking the stuff which cause him to overvalue cars by 3 to 4 times what theyre worth, what a twat!!!

[Terry Brooks]

Are they all on drugs in Chesterfield

Nahh ..........it's summatt thi purr in t' watter Ken [prob'ly bromide ......... so's all t' sheep can sleep safe at neet]

[DavidRutherford]

what do you know about Fiat X1/9s??

Could be wrong here Dave but I think David Rutherford knows a bit about X1/9s.

I hope that's true.. I have one, and have had 4 others.

X1/9's.

First, make sure you can fit in one and drive it comfortably. They are VERY small. It's not a car you drive, it's a car you wear.

Things to look for when buying:

1) Rust. Everywhere and anywhere. Main places are rear suspension turret stiffeners (inside the engine bay) front suspension turrets (inside luggage compartment) Rear edge of roll-hoop, front nosecone, windscreen surround, rear boot floor, bottoms of wings, rear wheel arches and bottoms of doors. Mine has corrosion in almost all of those places, and it's one of the last ever made (1990 registered) with only 32k miles on the clock. Every single X1/9 in existence has corrosion, it's just a case of how serious.

2) Gearbox. Weak as plasticine. Synchro on 3rd gear will be history, will probably jump out of reverse on a regular basis. Again, mine has a 24k mile box in it, which is already showing signs of both problems. Rebuilds with Fiat Uno Turbo (early) gear clusters are possible (and make it a far better box) but are not cheap.

3) Overheating. The X1/9 cooling system is marginal. Overheating is common as there is no thermo-syphon of the system. The pump is designed for a front-engine, and not really man enough for the task of pumping from a rear engine to a front rad. Rad cooling fans must work. Which leads me on to:

4) Electrical Gremlins. Italian Comedy wiring is evedent here more than any other car. I've had 2 electrical fires in X1/9's, and I fully expect another. Wiring is almost all substandard. Copper corrosion in the cables (when they go nice and black) is common. Some wires can disappear into the loom one colour and reappear in a different colour, the join being at the point "Luigi" ran out of cable on that particular day. Battery terminals are rubbish, and the cable from the alternator can easily burn on the exhaust. Headlamp lifting motors are a nightmare. Don't expect them to work. Second-hand ones are available and fairly cheap though.

5) Some parts availability. Clutch slave cylinder? You'll be lucky. Rear dampers? Not a chance. Body/interior parts? Second-hand only. Steering Rack? S/H or expect to pay a small fortune.

There are some good points though. The engine is a cracker, and rev's easily to 7.5k. The steering is lovely, the balance is slightly tail-happy. There's no power assisted anything (not even a servo on the brakes) so the driving experience is very pure. The car can be driven with the roof off regardless of the temperature, as with the windows up there's almost no wind buffett and the heater is amazingly powerful. It has a proper rear window, which is heated, so no silly plastic windows you can't see out of. The visibility is excellent.

Also, many parts are common with several other Fiat group cars, so are cheap and easily available. Brake discs are under a tenner each. Pads are about the same. Headlamps are 7" sealed beams, or replaceable with Mini/Land-rover/Range-rover 7" Halogen lamps. Alternators/Starters etc are standard fiat and cheap.

As for price. Don't ever pay more than £400 or so for something with short/no MOT. £1000 buys you a very nice one indeed with no work needed. Some people ask silly money for late model Gran Finale cars (like £3000). These cars are just as likely to be rotten as earlier cars. Tax is cheap as it falls into the smaller engine bracket. I paid £600 for mine with 12 months ticket and 6 month rent, and aside from the gearbox exploding within the first month (Due to some muppet filling it with ATF!!... and hence the replacement lower mileage one) has been a cracker.

Further reading:

Fiat X1/9: A Collectors Guide. By Phil Ward. ISBN 0 947981 83 7
www.x1-9ownersclub.org.uk

[stuart_hedges]

You like them then!

[DavidRutherford]

Does it show?

Designed and styled by the same bloke who did the BX... Marcello Gandini. He also did the Countach. Park a Countach, a BX and an X1/9 in a row, and the family resembelence is clear.

I like it so much in fact, I'm currently in the process of modifying a Fiat Uno Turbo engine to fit in it. This was for two reasons. 1, the car really needs more than the standard 85hp, and 2, the standard engine also suffers from hot-restart problems, whereby the carburettor gets so hot, all the petrol vaporises out of it, and you can't restart the engine. There is a carburettor cooling fan that is supposed to fix that, but it's not very effective. A more modern FI engine is a much better idea (and you get better fuel economy too.)

[Way2go]

Billy!

Way OT...but what do you know about Fiat X1/9s??
I'm thinking about one of the wee beasties, to do as a Summer Project!
The one I have in mind has a little T&T (to drive home!), but do you know of any hidden "nasties" to be aware of?

Cheers matey!

Dave

Bernie is knowledgeable in the FIAT arena. His avatar handle is "likes welding rusty FIAT's" so his advice shouuld be worthwhile.

[Way2go]

OOPs Just seen David's reply after posting. Seems as comprehensive a report as you could get!

[mountainmanUK]

Thanks a lot guys...especially David

Your advice goes pretty much along the lines of what I would have expected for a 20 yr old Italian car!. Lots of VERY interesting "insider" info too, which is much appreciated!
I suppose the way to handle the tinworm is to try to catch and fix it as soon as possible after it shows up, especially in those vital turret areas!

The actual X1/9 that I was hoping to buy last night eventually went for £262....which fits pretty nicely into your pricing levels, and I would have happily beaten that bid, except for the fact that I was called out urgently to my Dads, around an hour before the auction end. I completely forgot to "up" my Maximum bid from the £255 that I had set earlier! That particular car looked pretty decent, showing not much in the bad rust areas, but in need of a new front bumper (bigger federal job!) and a few other mechanic bits 'n bobs! It still had 2 months MOT and rent till July, so I could have got it home OK.

Following your excellent critique I am still determined to get myself into one of these...ASAP!

David, it's a shame you are so far down South from me...or I may have paid you a visit, for a "hands-on" tutorial!!!

Many thanks.......I'll be sure to let you all know when I find one!
Dave

[DavidRutherford]

I suppose the way to handle the tinworm is to try to catch and fix it as soon as possible after it shows up, especially in those vital turret areas!

When it comes to the rear (and front for that matter) turret stiffeners, once the corrosion is visible, then it's serious. These areas are triple skinned, and the corrosion starts between the skins, working it's way through them. The front is fairly easy to repair, as both sides are accessable. The rear is a different matter: it's an engine-out job to be able to cut out the corroded areas of turret/inner wing, and then weld in chompy great big bits of 3mm thick plate.
It is, however, a good bargaining point on any prospective car. Give it a poke with a screwdriver while the owner is watching, and you're sure to get the £1000 "minter" down to a more sensible price.

David, it's a shame you are so far down South from me...or I may have paid you a visit, for a "hands-on" tutorial!

I travel up north on a surprisingly regular basis. Last weekend I was in Grimsby. Next time I'm "ooop noooooorth", I'll be sure to look you up.