Oh Dear, the things I found today...

[Oscar]

I have to admit that I love the word c*nt! I would like to see similar sentiment and imagined meaning attached to prick, or whatever... Personally I think people who are offended by certain words want to be offended, to demonstrate that they are better than others. That's probable a bit c*ntentious. Isn't it the case that those who take offence to this word are the same people who have given it such imagined potency?

Well, I disagree. I've been thinking about this overnight, and there is something inherently offensive in taking a physical characteristic, and turning it into an insult. If I say "you wanker!" well, actually, your private life and my aspersions on it are pretty meaningless. If I say "you black scum" I'm making a physical characteristic with which one is born into an insult. As we can't choose our skin, or our genitalia (except for a few confused individuals), this is offensive, per se.

I thought c*nt was used by a French lady in one of those Shakespearian plays (Richard the something-or-other, "Once more into the breach my friends"). Isn't "cont" a French word for "idiot"?

As I say, time and place and context.

[scarecrow]

It is a matter of motivation surely? If the intention of any speech is to offend or insult, without good reason, then umbrage may rightly be taken. If, however, the motivation is benign or there is no specific motivation then I think it's a problem stemming from the psyche of the offended rather than the offender.

I think it's a bit high-handed for people to assume that everyone should have the same sensibilities as they have been inculcated with. There's no harm in us tolerating each others hang-ups for the sake of enjoying those parts of each others personalities which we don't find repulsive.

Personally, I instinctively think that c*nts are beautiful things. For me, using the word c*nt has no bearing on human physiology and generally has an entirely different meaning! The term "wanker", to me, says more about the person who uses it, and their hang-ups, than it does about the person it's directed towards.

Peace and love

[JayW]

I think I speak for most of the people on here I actually know (and therefore have fair judgement of) when I say: Does anyone give a shit anymore?

Some like, some don't. Everyone's different. And just because I find someone's face offensive doesn't mean I have to tell them, tell anyone else, criticise or punch them in it.

The title was "Shit". A hugely commonplace and jovial word and barely these days even considered a swear word, being muttered by 90% of the population 90% of the days of the week. Calling the thread "F*ck" or indeed "C*nt" would have been a step too far which is why MDS didn't use one of them.

Those who are offended by the word "Shit" REALLY need to lighten up, IMHO all MDS did wrong was not consider that some people are just that anal.

Tuppence given. Peace.

P.s. I love the english language, all of it. It is the simplest, most complicated and wonderfully annoying language in the world and I enjoy having great command of ALL it's complexities. Not one word of it offends me. The conveyance of emotion is one of english's greatest strengths over almost all other tongues.

[scarecrow]

Curiously I just had cause to make very good use of the word. Some bloke's husky just attacked my dog - after he'd told me that it was friendly and I allowed my dog to approach it. He took umbrage at my cocking my leg to kick his dog in the head before he decided to control it! Then he decided it was okay to threaten me physically - I'm not having that. The see you next tuesday went home with his tail between his legs, I don't suppose he expected me to immediately agree and backed down very quickly.

Bullying - now that's offensive.

[mat_fenwick]

It is a matter of motivation surely? If the intention of any speech is to offend or insult, without good reason, then umbrage may rightly be taken.

I agree entirely.

But...with the written word it is not always obvious what the intentions are without the benefit of body language. Therefore if a word is used that usually has negative connotations, it is understandable that conclusions may be jumped to and offence taken.

Thanks for the kind words Kevan.

[Way2go]

The choice of words in English is also a class thing...............

The word "urine" was first used in the 14th century. Before that, the concept was described by the now vulgar word "piss". Onomatopoetic in origins, "piss" was the primary means of describing urination, as "urinate" was at first used mostly in medical contexts. Likely, "piss" became vulgar through its use by lower class characters such as the reeve and the Wife of Bath in Geoffrey Chaucer's 14th century work The Canterbury Tales. "Piss" and its association with vulgarity has led to its current classification as obscene, as well as its use in such colloquial expressions as "to piss off" and "piss poor".

[scarecrow]

It is a matter of motivation surely? If the intention of any speech is to offend or insult, without good reason, then umbrage may rightly be taken.

I agree entirely.

But...with the written word it is not always obvious what the intentions are without the benefit of body language. Therefore if a word is used that usually has negative connotations, it is understandable that conclusions may be jumped to and offence taken.

Thanks for the kind words Kevan.

Quite right Mat, and I hope haven't caused any upset by my diatribe... but it's your own fault if I have

[Lester]

I'm sorry Kiwi...

http://www.bxclub.co.uk/forum/viewtopic ... 998#136998

[kiwi]

I love this 3 pages of trivial moralising and double standards all because I pointed out the Title of just one word "SHIT" was inappropriate. You can farking swear as much as your like on this forum which them makes a joke of the word filters you have in place as well.

Hmm moral highground? No just loving the double standards.
Have a Nice day threads no longer of interest even though your talking a lot of crap now.

[scarecrow]

I love this 3 pages of trivial moralising and double standards all because I pointed out the Title of just one word "SHIT" was inappropriate. You can farking swear as much as your like on this forum which them makes a joke of the word filters you have in place as well.

Hmm moral highground? No just loving the double standards.
Have a Nice day threads no longer of interest even though your talking a lot of crap now.

I was only interested in the moral debate - I don't actually give a monkey's about who complains about what. I thought you were joking anyway, and I don't think anyone is getting at you...

I hope we're all just 'avin' a larf

I promise not to swear in front of anyone who doesn't like it - I'm not quite narcissistic enough to believe everything I say is totally right - it's just what I think at the time.

[Oscar]

It is a matter of motivation surely? If the intention of any speech is to offend or insult, without good reason, then umbrage may rightly be taken. If, however, the motivation is benign or there is no specific motivation then I think it's a problem stemming from the psyche of the offended rather than the offender.

Not necessarily. If enough people say "I find that word offensive, please don't use it", then I think it behoves us to heed them, if we want to be better people in a better society.

And the usage of the word "****" is laden with 6000 years of misogyny resulting from (in my opinion) the invention of the monolitic male Jewish god. Prior to that, women were featured in the pantheon and had a role and a status in the house. Afterwards, misogyny ruled, and women's defining sexual characteristic became an insult. So we should stop saying it.

I swear too much, it's one of the things I don't like about myself. Perhaps this is trivial moralising, but isn't that the internet at its finest?

[scarecrow]

I have to disagree Oscar!!!

I don't believe that the majority are always right, by a long chalk.

I do believe in respect between human beings whatever their sex or age or whatever, but not because of something in ancient history, and I don't see why men and women can't be equal, yet different. As ever these inferred meanings only apply when people have understanding of them - I'm not sure everyone does? I don't think people generally say c*nt to denigrate womankind either - I might be wrong, but it's not generally the sentiment I understand.

I have to say I was quite shocked when I heard you swear. It must be the vicar in your avatar playing sub-conscious tricks on me.

I seem to remember reading that the Celts shaped the entrance portals to their holy places to look like giant vulvae. I understood that the real reason men stopped worshipping women was the discovery that they had a part to play in creating life too (or was it the invention of the credit card?) Before that the woman was worshipped as the miraculous sole giver of life. Unfortunately men did get a little too slap-happy after that.

Ma!

[electrokid]

Not necessarily. If enough people say "I find that word offensive, please don't use it", then I think it behoves us to heed them, if we want to be better people in a better society.

And I think that's all part of being a society - respect of others' opinions and sensibilities. Actually enshrined in law - it's illegal to be offensive - either by intent or through thoughtlessness - acting in a manner likely / intended to cause offense etc which is why we can be arrested for swearing in public.

Followers of the tv programme QI will have learnt that spoken words have sounds which have some relation to their meaning - 'spikey' has hard consonants - 'round' does not - in some measure the sound of spoken words reflect the physical form. I don't think the c word does that - I think it's blunt, basic - but then I guess I could be described as 'a moralist' of sorts so I'm happy to be in agreement with the society I happen to be in. I think that blunt and basic describes the word 'blog' as well - to me it sounds 'orrible so I don't use that word either. Can't think of any other examples - but then I don't dwell on stuff I don't like.

To reflect society's sesitivity to the word (and I think it should be the consensus of society as a whole - not just any particular moralist minority) I think it was 2001, google put in software to blanket ban any sites containing the c word - any such sites would never appear in search results. A UK toy company which had moved most of its sales activity to the web suddenly found it's sales plummetting - google wasn't listing it's links because the company was located in Scunthorpe Any urgent word in google's ear and a revision of their software followed and the toy company was back in business.

I don't think I was particularly offended by the invective in post titles - I think it was somehow out of place in a public forum where there is often a large amount of respect for opinions and viewpoints of people from all sorts of different backgrounds.

I don't believe that the majority are always right, by a long chalk.

Agreed - but they are still the majority - I don't think any minority should try to wield disproportionate influence - moral or amoral.

[docchevron]

I love this 3 pages of trivial moralising and double standards all because I pointed out the Title of just one word "SHIT" was inappropriate.

No, it's been three pages of discussion, quite intelligent discussion with well reasoned arguements for and against.
No-one's forcing you to read it.

You can farking swear as much as your like on this forum which them makes a joke of the word filters you have in place as well.

why? They were there long before the current administration came into being.
If you don't want to swear, fine, if you do, well ok, as above, in context etc etc, I personally have no problem with it.

Hmm moral highground? No just loving the double standards.
Have a Nice day threads no longer of interest even though your talking a lot of crap now.

how is anyone talking a load of crap?
It's been an interesting read, you're pissy because people disagree with you?

[kiwi]

I love this 3 pages of trivial moralising and double standards all because I pointed out the Title of just one word "SHIT" was inappropriate.

No, it's been three pages of discussion, quite intelligent discussion with well reasoned arguements for and against.
No-one's forcing you to read it.

You can farking swear as much as your like on this forum which them makes a joke of the word filters you have in place as well.

why? They were there long before the current administration came into being.
If you don't want to swear, fine, if you do, well ok, as above, in context etc etc, I personally have no problem with it.

Hmm moral highground? No just loving the double standards.
Have a Nice day threads no longer of interest even though your talking a lot of crap now.

how is anyone talking a load of crap?
It's been an interesting read, you're pissy because people disagree with you?

You misunderstand yet again ........ never mind

What a laugh though that the original title of one word "SHIT" should cause such a long winded debate when the title of the topic was nothing to do with Anal Bowl movements but about a poorly maintained vehicle.

How about another title change to "what a crappy thread"

Yes I was joking when I titled a thread "Fuck" and it drew attention. Funy that