frozen diesel

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Pigeon
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frozen diesel

Post by Pigeon » Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:05 pm

My TZD was outside the garage on -25 C without any aditive in diesel. I supose it is frozen. What should I do? Please help, I want to drive :)

Mothman

Post by Mothman » Thu Feb 02, 2012 4:48 pm

Hi, dont think you can do anything as diesel goes lumpy at -9 C i believe.
I would suggest when it warms up again you add some petrol at i think 13 to one ratio. Also hope you have plenty of antifreeze in your rad.

good luck,

Andy

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Post by mat_fenwick » Thu Feb 02, 2012 4:59 pm

The minimum temperature depends on the grade of diesel sold by the filling stations where you are - I would have thought that they would put the additives in, to be able to get it from the storage tanks into your car. Have you tried to start it?

You may be able to try heating the pipes, tank and injector pump to get the engine started (at which point the flow of heated fuel to the tank should be enough) if there is a problem but I'm not sure a UK forum is the best place to get help!
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Post by rmattila » Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:33 pm

Here they sell 3 qualities: "summer" (coldest storing temperature -5 / coldest operating temperature -15 C), "winter" (-15/-25) and "arctic" (either -29/-34 or -40/-44). The coldest storing temperature is where flakes start to form, and the coldest operating temperature is where the fuel will block a standard filter, preventing pumping.

If flakes are formed, the fuel will have to be heated to 10 deg C above the coldest storage temperature before they melt again.

Another issue is the water in fuel, which will of course freeze at zero, and possibly block the fuel filter already at that temperature.

I guess they don't change the fuel composition in the UK for winter (since the summer quality is cheaper to manufacture and has more energy in it), but play with additives instead. I have no experience on how they affect the fuel freezing behaviour.
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Post by Philip Chidlow » Thu Feb 02, 2012 5:47 pm

I use Millers Diesel Power Plus much of the time at concentrations that might help with cold weather issues - but I have now switched to Würth's saBesto Winter Diesel Additive which (it says) will stop fuel freezing at very low temperatures indeed. I wouldn't like to test it in such arctic conditions - or indeed regularly have to use the additive at the concentrations suggested (300ml per 50 litres at minus 26 degrees) as it isn't exactly cheap at nearly £11 per 300ml.

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Post by Defender110 » Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:19 pm

rmattila wrote: I guess they don't change the fuel composition in the UK for winter (since the summer quality is cheaper to manufacture and has more energy in it), but play with additives instead. I have no experience on how they affect the fuel freezing behaviour.
I'm not sure how they do it (additive or not) but we don't need to add winter additives ourselves anymore in the UK as fuel suppliers now supply winter diesel in the winter months.
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Post by MULLEY » Thu Feb 02, 2012 7:46 pm

BX tank is made of plastic, so flames will melt it :cry:

Never suffered from freezing diesel myself, inc the last 2 winters.

Where are you from Pigeon, or is this a spammer again?
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Post by Pigeon » Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:45 am

I'm from Belgrade, Serbia, and I'm not a spammer. My problem is real. You can watch weathercast, this days its cold here. Thanks to all of you. It seems that I have to wait hot days. :?

Mothman

Post by Mothman » Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:52 am

I remember the winter of 1986/87 when filling up my Hilux with diesel that there were white lumps just inside the filler cap. I then put about a gallon of petrol in it and didnt see the lumps again. It was about -10 at the time and in those days i dont think the refiners put any additives in diesel. Didnt seem to upset the performance of the motor in any way but gave me peace of mind. That winter was pretty nasty in the south east of England.
I remember driving into 6ft snow drifts at some speed to see what happened, exuberance of youth i suppose.

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Post by Defender110 » Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:50 am

Grenman wrote: I remember driving into 6ft snow drifts at some speed to see what happened, exuberance of youth i suppose.
Andy
I remember seeing a video on UTube or similar of a couple of youths driving a Land Rover into a 6' snowman to try and demolish it only to be left highly embaressed with a caved in Land Rover as the snow men builders had built it round a concrete road bollard :lol: :oops:
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1987 Citroen BX MK1 diesel estate.(Currently in dry storage)
1997 Mercedes C230 W202 - daily driver.
2010 BMW X1 SE 2.0D Auto - Her indoors daily driver.
2003 Land Rover Discovery Series 2 Facelift TD5 - Daily driver / hobby days and camping.
1993 Land Rover Discovery 200tdi Series 1 3 door - in need of TLC

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Post by rmattila » Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:11 am

Grenman wrote:I remember the winter of 1986/87 when filling up my Hilux with diesel that there were white lumps just inside the filler cap. I then put about a gallon of petrol in it and didnt see the lumps again.
Adding a few % of petrol is a well-known trick to temporarily improve the cold resistance of fuel. However, at least here the modern diesel fuel is so "dry" that adding some 2-stroke oil along with the petrol would be a good idea to prevent the injection pump from wearing out excessively.
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Post by smiffy1071 » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:24 pm

Pigeon wrote:I'm from Belgrade, Serbia, and I'm not a spammer. My problem is real. You can watch weathercast, this days its cold here. Thanks to all of you. It seems that I have to wait hot days. :?
If you are near electricity, you could, ummm, (borrow) your wifes hair dryer when she isn't looking, and gently heat the fuel pump and filter, which will allow the engine to start. The next bit is to keep it going, so I suggest adding some Kerosene, (parrafin) to the fuel tank, to prevent the fuel waxing up...diesel turns to wax at about minus 5ºc. I'm no expert here, but I would put 1 litre kerosene, to 15 litres diesel.

You could use a small ammount of petrol instead of kerosene, BUT, this is probably illegal, it certainly is here in UK.

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Post by sdelasal » Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:07 pm

...it certainly is here in UK. I don't think so - the government will have extracted sufficient tax from you, when you bought the petrol - that's all they will be concerned about £££.

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Post by MULLEY » Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:03 pm

We've had some idiot(s) on here, that usually just start posting up stuff & haven't done any introductions of who they are, where they are & what car(s) they have. You fitted the profile apologies Pigeon, no offence intended.

Now we need some pictures of your car(s) :D
2002 C5 2.0 HDI Estate - Remapped - It goes better
2011 Mini Cooper D Clubman - it does over 60mpg
1992 TZD Turbo - SORN - slowly getting there
1991 Gti 16V - Blaze is back on the road since 2008
1990 Gti 8Valve SOLD - looks like it's been scrapped
2002 Mini Cooper S - SOLD - i miss this car
1992 TXD - Scrapped in March 2014

I'm not just a username, i'm also called Matthew.

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Post by smiffy1071 » Sat Feb 04, 2012 4:09 am

sdelasal wrote:...it certainly is here in UK. I don't think so - the government will have extracted sufficient tax from you, when you bought the petrol - that's all they will be concerned about £££.
to hell with the government taxation, I was thinking more on an anti-pollution line. Also, adding petrol can cause premature engine and fuel pump wear, because petrol of course has no lubricating properties....