and it was all going so well....urgent brainstormin' please!

[tim]

Just finished repiping the White One and I was hoping to write something tomorrow on the lines of 'sorted'. However, the "OH, COCK" rule has been invoked. Absolute bastard. She started up OK yesterday although the battery needed a recharge. Brakes bled up beautifully in about 5 seconds flat, and everything worked fine; had her on tickover for a while in high, and everything was where it should be. Hoorah.
However - tonight I put in the recharged battery, and took out the axle stands. I then drove backwards a tad to remove axle stands and shut the bonnet. Noticed the fluid level was low, then got back in and the red light was on. wtf.... got out and heard the sound of running liquid. The r.h. sphere appeared to have blown as a steady stream of green stuff was pissing out from beneath the flange of the sphere. Where I haven't been at all.
So what did I do wrong?? If there was a fault in the new pipe and there was a blockage surely there'd be lack of action rather than too much? Anyhow, I'm going to mop up the puddle and hope the ol' Brains Trust can tell me where to go next. I'm also as certain as can be that pipes are not mixed up or crossed, and in any event what could produce this effect? I would love to think it is just the seal blown on the sphere but this is too much of a coincidence. And this is the first time the full weight of the car has been transferred to the rear arms.

[tim]

Having had a chat with a couple of people a few ideas have emerged. One is that somehow the new pipes have increased the pressure to the strut and revealed a weak point, maybe the pipe into the strut itself. The other is that standing for four weeks has allowed a seal to dry out and this has now let go. Not sure about that one but I offer it up. I'm not sure about the pipe either, they are well protected where the pipe enters the strut and I would be surprised to see a rotten section there - or is that wrong..... whatever, something has popped.

[Jaba]

What a pain but by no means is it unusual for a BX to annoy and frustrate. It is all part of the Joy of BX (there's a book in that somewhere).

So you have a bad leak from the rear susp. strut. If you have not disturbed the sphere during the repairs then there are two likely causes. Broken hydraulic pipe or more likely the cylinder has corroded and sprung a leak which will be worse at the high setting. A close inspection will tell (possibly !)

Jaba, poetry in motion.

[tim]

sad but true! This isn't a leak so much as a mega-flood. Something has obviously failed big-time. Yes, a close look tomorrow after work should reveal what has gone... I'm more curious as to why. A corroded pipe would be a nice simple solution, but why now?

[citronut]

so to clarify Tim
is the leak at the front or rear of the car,

if the rear didnt you fit new cylinder feed pipes whilst the sub frame was down????

the other cause could be a flare on one of the new pipes was not flared enough, so has come through the flare nut,

i have seen this once on newly fitted copper pipe

regards malcolm

[Oilyspanner]

Has the ram piston popped out ? I had it once where the pushrod had snapped off, leaving it a little shorter, not noticed at all until full height was needed, then there was a green flood.

[tim]

Ok.... the leak is at the rear, I haven't been near the front and the sphere and pipes are clearly visible anyway. No, I didn't repipe the struts; I had to draw the line somewhere regarding costs and the work involved. And the pipes, what I could see of them, looked OK. So if it is a pipe failure, it's a purely coincidental case of it deciding to go at just the wrong moment.
Ram piston - well, possibly! That hadn't occurred to me but the rods are existing ones and have functioned happily for years. However, something to check. It would certainly explain the flood which seems more than a single popped pipe would produce; I know that one from four weeks ago and I was still able to do the two miles home. But what for it do this.... the flood was coming from round the base of the sphere though, I'd have thought a popped piston would produce a flood at the other end of the gaiter? I don't think it's the sphere itself but the steel cowling is obviously directing the flow that way.
So it looks like the way to go is to remove the sphere to be able to eyeball pipe into strut. The pipe will probably be seized solid regardless so if I can see a break then it's repipe time and the strut will have to come off. If the pipe looks solid then it must be the strut so it will still have to come off. Luckily the good old scrappy comes to the rescue again and I just went via Andy to remove the remaining strut both to have a second spare and to remind myself how to get the bugger out.
Just so you know, the pipe has to be undone or cut first. The unit is held in place by a big steel retainer which in turn is held in by a big spring clip which hooks over the inner edge of the cowling. You then unhook it using a screwdriver and violence, and the plate can then be wiggled off and the unit withdrawn forwards.
And while I'm there, the beast could do with two new gaiters. Can anyone (OK, I mean you Malcolm of course!) give us a source or part no. It's the estate so gaiters are longer.

[citronut]

the ram feed pipes dont cost very much at all, and are by far easier to fit whilst the sub frame is down'

sounds like a ram feed pipe or a ram has corroded through,

probably find all the disturbing of the sub frame, and the system being completely depressurised ,
the ram had gone limp causing all the crud wedging it into the sub frame has moved, along with the corrosion of the ram body,


regards malcolm

[KevR]

I'm not sure about the pipe either, they are well protected where the pipe enters the strut and I would be surprised to see a rotten section there - or is that wrong..... .

Yep, you're quite right, in as much as you're wrong....

I've seen quite a few horribly rusty pipes there.

[tim]

Fairy nuff - though with further thought aided by beer, I still think the flood is too much to explain a pipe split. I talked to Pleiades this a.m. and asked Martin if he had any ideas and he was also puzzled; he thought a possible culprit might well be the ram having rotted out at the bottom by the sphere. And that the problem really might be just coincidence. Well, I've got a couple of spares off the scrappy so if it doesn't piss down on Saturday I know where I'll be.... again.
Any ideas on the rear gaiter sources?

[Dollywobbler]

When mine blew a front-to-rear pipe, plenty of fluid flooded out. Are you sure it isn't that? It was very tricky to find as it sprayed LHM everywhere at a serious pressure.

[citronut]

the gaiters are still showing as available from citroen below id price and part No.'s for it and the clamp

Part Number Description Quantity Price excl. VAT Price incl. VAT Total incl. VAT Selection
26140919 BOOT CLAMP 5.64 GBP 6.77 GBP 6.77 GBP

95577323 CYLINDER BOOT 8.06 GBP 9.67 GBP 9.67 GBP

all the BX rams i have seen eaten away have gone were the ram sits against the neck of the coned section of the sub frame


regards malcolm

[tim]

Well, been there, done that. The answer is yes, it was coincidence - sort of. The ram body has two rot holes in it about halfway along, and on squirting brake cleaner into the hole you could see it wicking through on the inside. So it would have let go tomorrow, or next week. I guess that standing still for four weeks it not really the issue, more a fact of fitting new pipes that could deliver a full-pressure load of fluid; the old ones must have been as rusty on the inside as the outside and this surely must have restricted the flow a bit. So the scrappy one will be going on, and as soon as time permits, the other side will need attention. By the way, the pipe was in good condition, but I had to cut the thing because there wasn't much hex head left on the union. Cock.
I haven't looked; are new rams available at all, and how much? The ram could be alloy welded without too much grief, but would then have to be rebored to ensure circularity. But it looks perfectly doable; anyone tried it?

[mat_fenwick]

The inside of the ram isn't a sealing face, so as long as enough it wasn't proud on the inside and cleared the piston, reboring wouldn't be necessary. Don't know if anyone has tried it...

[citronut]

the citro blood pressure has nout to do with this failure in the slightest Tim,

what has happened is whilst the sub frame was down and the system fully depressurised,

the ram can then move freely in the sub frame, so freeing all the crud and rubbish that has built up between it and the ram over the years,

in turn this will disturb the corrosion on the ram body hence the flood of citro blood,

hydraulic pipes can not rust internally all the while they have citro blood running through them

i have often thought about getting the perforations welded upon corroded rams,

i cant see any reason why it should not work,
i also think if you had a scrap piston inside the ram whilst being welded you would not need to have the inside re/machined,

as long as the welding is nowhere near the pressure seal and the piston moves freely

regards malcolm ,