Exhausts

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Thread Bear
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Exhausts

Post by Thread Bear »

Homer is a 1.9 n/a diesel. The rear two silencer boxes are dead. The mid section pipe is so cheap a bit of crap as to be chucked directly as its corners narrow the pipe badly. It also does not really fit. The front pipe is good but was not fitted correctly so was blowing. In the paperwork is a receipt from Kwik Fart, that explains why its fallen off in a few years, but passed the moan by date.

Question one. This inferior design of exhaust system, push and clamp, seems pretty much common to the smaller petrol cars as well. The manifold has a curved exit with the exhaust meeting it with a curved socket. The mounting is a sprung loaded job with chamfered pin and nasty 10mm head and nut. Being a hero I got these off but I bet they are bloody useless when old. Is/should there be a gasket in this joint? If not why is my manifold covered in bits of thick wire like a wire brush has been welded to it?

Question two. This original exhaust, in my humble opinion, is inadequate for a 1.9 diesel engine. I think it will strangle performance. My 205 1.8 had a bigger bore as the 1.7 Turbo BX. Not only that but I have a complete 1.7 Turbo system spare. A far better designed item throughout with demountable joints rather than shove and clamp. Thus you can make it fit perfectly so it lasts longer and will not rattle. Will this fit on Homer? My suspicion is the manifold is different so it will not.

About to mount rebuilt rear hub, so saving £19 odd. Squeak, squeak. Then I can get the trailer out from behind the dead Homer for moving galvanised 1200 Lt diesel tank and loading Aga type stove bought on Evilby tomorrow. That should naff us all up till Sunday quite effectively.
Miguel - 16 TRS Auto S, light blue, 43k miles - £450
Pluto - 14 E S, White, 105k Miles - in work
Egbert - 19 16v Gti, White, A/C & Leather, - Keeper
Walt - 17 TZD Turbo S, graphite, 70k miles, good op extras - Keeper
Scraper- 17 TZD Turbo E, blue, 208k miles - parts
Homer - 19 TXD E, Red, 189k miles - £250
Gary - 17 TZD Turbo E, 118k miles - in work

'87 Trooper, Borgwards, Saabs, MG ZB, Bellamy Trials, Fiat Jolly & Bianchina, Goggo Dart, Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Bubblecars
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Tim Leech
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Tim Leech »

The turbo d and n/a are different bore but the TD system I am sure can be adapted to fit, but the front pipe on the turbo will be wider bore and the manifold different, maybe you could sleev it to fit.

Mike Sims has a TD middle and rear box on timex.

The 1.9 D has the same rear exhaust sections to 1.4 and 1.6 petrol.
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Tinkley
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Tinkley »

If its like the petrols there is a wire mesh conical gasket that seats into the down pipe from the manifold. It should contain some 'putty' like material that flows and seals when hot to get a seal. Get a genuine one as the aftermarket kits are not as good. The kit is not expensive circa 10-12 quid and has all the stuff.

Forget undoing the bolts, put an angle grinder through them, springs and all; at least I did, without even trying a spanner. Pretty tight to get in there on the o/s and probably tighter with a diesel.
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Thread Bear »

Blimey that was quick. You should be working :lol:

The gasket advice fits the clues. So its not been fitted tight and has chucked the gasket out. Probably put on loose and forgot to tighten it when in position. So recent and of minimal mileage is the exhaust I could undo it through mild rust. I have strong hands, if I can get them round her throat, sorry, onto the nuts and bolts. So I need a clean up and a gasket to effect that end as a repair. Yes after market ones tend not to be self glueing but a very solid and sculpted brillo pad thing. Might have one if its as on a Pug.

The Mike Sims 'make it larger' has merit as you get the better rear system but the front pipe is a restriction. I think mine is factory/quality replacement as its good material and well formed. I have a spare to, but that is after market, I think. Wish I had time to offer up the stashed TD front pipe and see how far out it is.

Alternative is to take the system off the 1.6 Auto if it looks the same. It will need a new system sooner than later more than likely. The car warrants some expenditure where as Homer is a bangernomics car. I am tight enough to try some used rear spheres I have marked as OK from bud up the road. Homers look older than the car!
Miguel - 16 TRS Auto S, light blue, 43k miles - £450
Pluto - 14 E S, White, 105k Miles - in work
Egbert - 19 16v Gti, White, A/C & Leather, - Keeper
Walt - 17 TZD Turbo S, graphite, 70k miles, good op extras - Keeper
Scraper- 17 TZD Turbo E, blue, 208k miles - parts
Homer - 19 TXD E, Red, 189k miles - £250
Gary - 17 TZD Turbo E, 118k miles - in work

'87 Trooper, Borgwards, Saabs, MG ZB, Bellamy Trials, Fiat Jolly & Bianchina, Goggo Dart, Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Bubblecars
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the pipes

Post by Oilyspanner »

The auto should donate its system I reckon, unless you can make up a reducer from the bigger TD pipe down to the smaller system and make the join somewhere accessible, and you will still need to replace the sealing ring, The larger bore system will probably improve the performance about as much as blowing your nose :) .
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Tinkley »

In my experience the 1.6 (petrol) front pipe (from manifold back) is pretty sturdy and the factory ones will last 15 years +. The 1.4 system is not as robust. The 1.6 pipe is bifurcated so for some distance, I believe near full length) it is double wall effectively. A bit of external rust does not tell you what the pipe is like inside. If you have the pipe off the manifold you will see 2 half moon bits of pipe going into and along the main outer pipe. I did change it on my old Athena and it was original, after it started to corrode at the back bit 17 years after it left the factory.... :D
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Thread Bear »

Rain stopped play. More food for thought. Thanks chaps.

Realised that Homer is missing its rear disc backing plates. Rusted away.
Miguel - 16 TRS Auto S, light blue, 43k miles - £450
Pluto - 14 E S, White, 105k Miles - in work
Egbert - 19 16v Gti, White, A/C & Leather, - Keeper
Walt - 17 TZD Turbo S, graphite, 70k miles, good op extras - Keeper
Scraper- 17 TZD Turbo E, blue, 208k miles - parts
Homer - 19 TXD E, Red, 189k miles - £250
Gary - 17 TZD Turbo E, 118k miles - in work

'87 Trooper, Borgwards, Saabs, MG ZB, Bellamy Trials, Fiat Jolly & Bianchina, Goggo Dart, Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Bubblecars
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Re: Exhausts

Post by citronut »

no putty or glue involved in the woven wire sealing ring at all,

a lot of the kwack shit shops only use the cheepy version which is fiber not woven wire,

i also dont think it matters on the after meercat front as long as its a woven wire sealing ring,

the idea of this spring loaded joint is to act as a flexi coupling, so is meant to be able to pivot as the engine moves

regards malcolm
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Thread Bear »

Indeed. A bit of give but a seal for all that. The great failing on the mini was the rigid exhaust flange which used to fail after a while if you drove hard and failed to adequately mount the top of the engine. The nut heads could be a bit bigger on the BX though. But yes, its more modern, so cut and replace would fit the bill. Not my natural way of working though.
Miguel - 16 TRS Auto S, light blue, 43k miles - £450
Pluto - 14 E S, White, 105k Miles - in work
Egbert - 19 16v Gti, White, A/C & Leather, - Keeper
Walt - 17 TZD Turbo S, graphite, 70k miles, good op extras - Keeper
Scraper- 17 TZD Turbo E, blue, 208k miles - parts
Homer - 19 TXD E, Red, 189k miles - £250
Gary - 17 TZD Turbo E, 118k miles - in work

'87 Trooper, Borgwards, Saabs, MG ZB, Bellamy Trials, Fiat Jolly & Bianchina, Goggo Dart, Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Bubblecars
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Tinkley »

Spot on Malcolm. My genuine replacement wire mesh gasket did not have the sealer in it but the after meerkat one did. The latter was a wire one not fibre. Conjecture would suggest TB's gasket was a fibre cheapy that disintegrated. After all the faffing I had to do to get the bolts and cups to fit with the after meerkat one, its genuine only from now on. I was under the impression it was a genuine one when I bought it, but alas no. Seems to work OK though after a bit of settling.
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Re: Exhausts

Post by citsncycles »

What I did on Timex was leave the front pipe (as it was in good nick, plus I couldn't get hold of a TD item), then use TD items from the '?' shaped pipe back. I have sleeved it but the joint is blowing a bit so I'll revisit it before the MOT in the next couple of weeks. If I could have got a TD front pipe, I'd have used as much of it as possible, with a short piece of the NA pipe just to mate up with the (square port) manifold.

Unless someone's restocked, those '?' shaped piped in TD form are no longer available - neither my independant exhaust specialists, or Tony Weston could locate a new one for me so I ended up using a good used one from a valver!

Anyway, if sourcing diesel exhausts is getting interesting, what're the chances of me finding any exhaust sections for a 4x4 estate?
Mike Sims
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Re: Exhausts

Post by Thread Bear »

The TD/Gti ? pipe going extinct is a bit of a bummer. I think all the rest is available. Its just me being a pikey and not wanting to shell out when I have a whole spare system. It is a TD one so maybe I should just shelve it and buy Homer some new bits. Cannot bare the thought of someone else gaining the value of it, don't you know!
Miguel - 16 TRS Auto S, light blue, 43k miles - £450
Pluto - 14 E S, White, 105k Miles - in work
Egbert - 19 16v Gti, White, A/C & Leather, - Keeper
Walt - 17 TZD Turbo S, graphite, 70k miles, good op extras - Keeper
Scraper- 17 TZD Turbo E, blue, 208k miles - parts
Homer - 19 TXD E, Red, 189k miles - £250
Gary - 17 TZD Turbo E, 118k miles - in work

'87 Trooper, Borgwards, Saabs, MG ZB, Bellamy Trials, Fiat Jolly & Bianchina, Goggo Dart, Messerschmitt, Heinkel, Bubblecars
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