TD overheating - check your fans!

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KevR
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TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by KevR » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:33 am

Just a warning to BX owners in general and TD owners in particular - check your radiator fans actually work!
Just done a trip to the Alps in the Grey One for a cycling holiday. 600 miles there in one hit, no problem - two people, two bikes, a load of kit and a 1200cc Suzuki bike engine in the back to deliver on the way. Another six hundred miles in one hit on the way back - again no problem.
In between, one trip from Bourg d'Oisans to St Michel de Maurienne, three people, three bikes, hot day, over a bloody hreat mountain. Halfway up the Col de la Croix de Fer the orange temp light came on. Stopped, checked, fans not on. Fuses ok. Jumped terminals from plug which goes to rad switch - nothing. Checked fans themselves. Right hand fan (looking from driver's seat) is completely seized so that explains that. Left hand fan not working either. Hotwired from battery pos to fan pos - nothing. Eventually realised there seems to be a problem with the earth on that side, so swapped to the earth from the right hand fan - success. From then on, no problem at all, but if I'd not been able to get that one going, could well have been in proper trouble.

This is the only second time the temp light's come on in over 100,000 miles in my ownership - last time in heavy traffic many years ago, resolved itself as soon as we started moving again. Remade all connections to fans at that point, checked operation and then forgot all about it.

So... on the list is a fan override switch so I can at least check all the wiring works on a regular basis, and maybe a proper temperature gauge as well....
1990 BX TZD Estate ('the grey one', 1991 BX TZD Estate ('the white one'), 1982 2CV6 Charleston (in bits), 1972 AZU Serie B (2CV van), 1974 HY72 Camper, 1990 Land Rover 110 diesel LWB, 1957 Mobylette AV76, 1992 Ducati 400SS, 1966 VW Beetle, 1990 Mazda MX-5, 1996 Peugeot 106D, 1974 JCB 2D MkII, 1997 BMW R1100RS, 1987 Suzuki GSX-R1100, 1978 Honda CX500A, 1965 Motobecane Cady, 1988 Honda Bros/Africa Twin, 1963 Massey Ferguson 825, and a lot of bicycles!

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by rutter123 » Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:20 am

I think a digital temp gauge is a must on all bx's, its the only accurate way to monitor your engines behavior, ive set my cooling fans to cut in at 88 degrees just to be doubly safe, a fan overide switch is also a safe bet as is too an indication light on the dash so you know when your fan has cut in. All quite simple mods and will save your engine from ultimate meltdown.
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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by KevR » Mon Aug 17, 2015 12:03 pm

Don't think I need a warning light to tell me the fan's cut in - it's louder than the engine!
1990 BX TZD Estate ('the grey one', 1991 BX TZD Estate ('the white one'), 1982 2CV6 Charleston (in bits), 1972 AZU Serie B (2CV van), 1974 HY72 Camper, 1990 Land Rover 110 diesel LWB, 1957 Mobylette AV76, 1992 Ducati 400SS, 1966 VW Beetle, 1990 Mazda MX-5, 1996 Peugeot 106D, 1974 JCB 2D MkII, 1997 BMW R1100RS, 1987 Suzuki GSX-R1100, 1978 Honda CX500A, 1965 Motobecane Cady, 1988 Honda Bros/Africa Twin, 1963 Massey Ferguson 825, and a lot of bicycles!

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by mijfife » Mon Aug 17, 2015 8:35 pm

One of the fans on my TZD doesn't work either, the one that does is extremely loud and screechy :roll: My orange light comes on before the thermostat has opened so I bought a digital temperature gauge off Amazon, which arrived today, it's this one
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B009 ... ge_o00_s00

It's small enough to sit on the steering column infront of the dials without obscuring anything or is quite discrete mounted in the corner of the dash board near the window. The only thing I'll need to do is get or make a reducing bush from the M12 orange light sender hole down to M10 for the gauge sender.
The digital display shows the temperature in both figures and a pointer that indicates the temp on the top scale. I'm hoping to get it fitted asap so will report back on how it does.

Regards, Jim
1991 BX TZD Hatchback, biodiesel powered :D
2007 Peugeot Partner 1.6HDi - everyday work horse, totally reliable but so dull :roll: 60k miles on my homemade biodiesel so mega cheap to run!
1967 Singer Chamois Coupe - owned since 1998, fully restored by myself - love it.
1991 Kawasaki GPz900r - owned since 2004, awaiting light restoration & a bit of TLC.
2002 Triumph Daytona 955i - bought in 2014 so that I could take Kawasaki off the road to restore - that's my excuse anyway :lol:

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by kernowtim » Mon Aug 17, 2015 8:54 pm

Must check the cooling fans and lights on my estate, no idea if they work, last time I thought about it was when I made the mistake of going on m25, roadworks bought 4 lanes down to 1, thought I would be OK at 11.30 on a Friday night!!
Presumably earthing wires from senders on engine would put revelant
Iights on.
Got extra kenlowe fan, don't know if that works either!!

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by mijfife » Mon Aug 17, 2015 9:01 pm

Yep, earthing the wire from the sender should bring on the relevent light. Bridging out the two terminals on the fan switch multiplug on the side of the radiator should bring on the fans.

Regards, Jim
1991 BX TZD Hatchback, biodiesel powered :D
2007 Peugeot Partner 1.6HDi - everyday work horse, totally reliable but so dull :roll: 60k miles on my homemade biodiesel so mega cheap to run!
1967 Singer Chamois Coupe - owned since 1998, fully restored by myself - love it.
1991 Kawasaki GPz900r - owned since 2004, awaiting light restoration & a bit of TLC.
2002 Triumph Daytona 955i - bought in 2014 so that I could take Kawasaki off the road to restore - that's my excuse anyway :lol:

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by KevR » Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:47 am

mijfife wrote: Bridging out the two terminals on the fan switch multiplug on the side of the radiator should bring on the fans.
Which it didn't on mine last week, so I need to investigate that.
1990 BX TZD Estate ('the grey one', 1991 BX TZD Estate ('the white one'), 1982 2CV6 Charleston (in bits), 1972 AZU Serie B (2CV van), 1974 HY72 Camper, 1990 Land Rover 110 diesel LWB, 1957 Mobylette AV76, 1992 Ducati 400SS, 1966 VW Beetle, 1990 Mazda MX-5, 1996 Peugeot 106D, 1974 JCB 2D MkII, 1997 BMW R1100RS, 1987 Suzuki GSX-R1100, 1978 Honda CX500A, 1965 Motobecane Cady, 1988 Honda Bros/Africa Twin, 1963 Massey Ferguson 825, and a lot of bicycles!

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by tim » Tue Aug 18, 2015 10:51 am

Interesting... I put a thread up recently hoping for a wiring diagram to revive my fans. However, nothing came up from anyone so I had to get on and work it out myself.
What I think is right is this. First of all buy new sensor for rad. Power goes into this (12v) when ignition is on. Sensor warms up, switches on and power returns via the cylindrical feed mounted on the chassis behind the front vents, and then completes the circuit. Instant fan. So I connected the sensor, dipped it into a saucepan of boiling water and about 40 seconds later, we had... nothing. So I cut back the wiring from the fan by a couple of inches so the wire wasn't entirely green, added new connectors and THEN we had a fan. All we need now is a hot day. (I also replaced the feed unit as I didn't trust it). I don't think I missed anything but comments (constructive ones) welcome. Also the talk of a temp gauge is useful, but can someone produce a simple diagram for this??

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by KevR » Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:01 am

"cylindrical feed mounted on the chassis behind the vents"

Not sure what you mean by that - got a pic?
1990 BX TZD Estate ('the grey one', 1991 BX TZD Estate ('the white one'), 1982 2CV6 Charleston (in bits), 1972 AZU Serie B (2CV van), 1974 HY72 Camper, 1990 Land Rover 110 diesel LWB, 1957 Mobylette AV76, 1992 Ducati 400SS, 1966 VW Beetle, 1990 Mazda MX-5, 1996 Peugeot 106D, 1974 JCB 2D MkII, 1997 BMW R1100RS, 1987 Suzuki GSX-R1100, 1978 Honda CX500A, 1965 Motobecane Cady, 1988 Honda Bros/Africa Twin, 1963 Massey Ferguson 825, and a lot of bicycles!

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by mijfife » Tue Aug 18, 2015 8:07 pm

Hi Ken, the most basic wiring for a temperature gauge is as follows: an ignition controlled live feed to the + side of the gauge, the negative side goes to the temperature sender unit which then completes the circuit to earth. Obviously a fuse and pehaps a voltage stabiliser would be worth adding along with a light that you can see at night.
There was an excellent thread on here that shows the fitment of the 205gti gauge into the dash in place of the lights of doom, have a look at smiffy1071's post within the thread
http://www.bxclub.co.uk/forum/viewtopic ... ge#p204084

Hope that helps, regards, Jim
1991 BX TZD Hatchback, biodiesel powered :D
2007 Peugeot Partner 1.6HDi - everyday work horse, totally reliable but so dull :roll: 60k miles on my homemade biodiesel so mega cheap to run!
1967 Singer Chamois Coupe - owned since 1998, fully restored by myself - love it.
1991 Kawasaki GPz900r - owned since 2004, awaiting light restoration & a bit of TLC.
2002 Triumph Daytona 955i - bought in 2014 so that I could take Kawasaki off the road to restore - that's my excuse anyway :lol:

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by Tinkley » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:37 am

Had most of these problems on one car!. Will say bridging the Fan switch usually lets you know if the circuit is good, and will keep fan permanently on. One car had seized fan, blown fuse (No 4 - 20 amp), fan switch thermostat gone and all at the same time!. Worked fine with all these resolved....and even ran OK with all these faults!.

I'd also say if you have the plastic thermostat housing 1336.A1 you ought to change it as mine sheared completely under the top rad hose, dumping 5 ltr of coolant. Just old age, and Peugeot still can supply new.

Are the actual fans available? I have the single fan type on the 1.6, likely the same as the 14 TU engine. Not found any when I'v looked on the web. Radiators, no problem, but fans seem to be. Doubtless a later one may be made fit.

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by KevR » Wed Aug 19, 2015 9:59 am

Radiators are definitely a problem for the TDs. I've got a few spare fans but will need to hunt down some more - planning on fitting one on my Land Rover in place of the viscous coupled one, and might convert the H van as well.

Looks like I need a Gti dash for spares then. Or maybe two...
1990 BX TZD Estate ('the grey one', 1991 BX TZD Estate ('the white one'), 1982 2CV6 Charleston (in bits), 1972 AZU Serie B (2CV van), 1974 HY72 Camper, 1990 Land Rover 110 diesel LWB, 1957 Mobylette AV76, 1992 Ducati 400SS, 1966 VW Beetle, 1990 Mazda MX-5, 1996 Peugeot 106D, 1974 JCB 2D MkII, 1997 BMW R1100RS, 1987 Suzuki GSX-R1100, 1978 Honda CX500A, 1965 Motobecane Cady, 1988 Honda Bros/Africa Twin, 1963 Massey Ferguson 825, and a lot of bicycles!

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Re: TD overheating - check your fans!

Post by KevR » Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:37 pm

Looking on Eflog, there appears to be no shortage of 205 GTi gauges. Is there any way round the 'problem' of the different backlight colours?
1990 BX TZD Estate ('the grey one', 1991 BX TZD Estate ('the white one'), 1982 2CV6 Charleston (in bits), 1972 AZU Serie B (2CV van), 1974 HY72 Camper, 1990 Land Rover 110 diesel LWB, 1957 Mobylette AV76, 1992 Ducati 400SS, 1966 VW Beetle, 1990 Mazda MX-5, 1996 Peugeot 106D, 1974 JCB 2D MkII, 1997 BMW R1100RS, 1987 Suzuki GSX-R1100, 1978 Honda CX500A, 1965 Motobecane Cady, 1988 Honda Bros/Africa Twin, 1963 Massey Ferguson 825, and a lot of bicycles!